Tipping At A Restaurant

The Lonious Monk said:
Dude all that shit you wrote was for nothing. We already have restaurants here who have moved away from the tip system and they did exactly what I'm saying they would do. And several other restaurant chains have said they are going to do the same thing. So the shit you're saying doesn't mean anything. At the day, what I'm saying is already a reality at mean places and will soon be at many more. So what I said remains. In a lot of establishments, you're either going to pay a service charge or a tip, but either way you're paying your server.
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sigh... You really believe this, don't you?

You do know that restaurants are under no legal obligation to hand over money collected as a "service charge" to their waitstaff, right?

Most restaurants that charge a "service fee" or whatnot don't give it to their employees; that shit goes straight into the owner's pocket. The owner might use that money to increase everyone's salary so there's no direct correlation between a service charge and the servers being the people that solely benefit from it like tips did. On top of that, places that charge a service fee also discourage tipping their waitstaff.

https://www.laweekly.com/restaurant...staurant-industry-or-legal-wage-theft-7852984

"... Like most people, I assumed that the service charge is a tip. In fact, it is not — in Los Angeles, the money belongs 100 percent to the business itself.

"It is a total land grab," one L.A. server, who spoke on the condition of anonymity, told me the day after my service-charges story came out. "These guys are just taking the money and running. It's bullshit." The server described the experience of working in one restaurant that operated with the service-charge model. "At first it was great — we were all making a ton of money. The dishwashers were making, like, $18 an hour! It was amazing for them to have an actual living wage. Everyone was so happy. The servers were making money, the cooks were making money. And then the owners realized that there was all this cash that was legally theirs, and they were giving it away. And slowly, the money started to disappear. We weren't any less busy. But the money went away, and it went straight into the pockets of the owners."

I was told by another disgruntled employee (who asked for anonymity) that it's now becoming commonplace for owners to pocket "service charges" in some of the city's high-end sushi restaurants..."

That's not to say there aren't ordinances on the books that make it illegal for an owner to keep the service charges, 'cause as the article explains Santa Monica has that on the books, but they're hardly in the majority, so those service charges become free money to the owners and while they do use it pay better wages to their employees, it also adds a helluva pad to their bottom line.
 
lol Who is talking about legal obligations? Restaurants aren't obligated to give servers all their tips either. Shitty restaurants actually don't give the tips fairly. You're writing this titangraphs, but you aren't really saying anything of substance. Like I said, many restaurants already do this and more are moving towards it. I didn't say all restaurants are doing it or will do it, but the point is for a lot of them that do transition away from tips, people will wind up paying one way or the other.
 
The Lonious Monk said:
lol Who is talking about legal obligations? Restaurants aren't obligated to give servers all their tips either. Shitty restaurants actually don't give the tips fairly. You're writing this titangraphs, but you aren't really saying anything of substance. Like I said, many restaurants already do this and more are moving towards it. I didn't say all restaurants are doing it or will do it, but the point is for a lot of them that do transition away from tips, people will wind up paying one way or the other.
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https://www.nationalreview.com/2017...regulations-labor-department-makes-good-move/

"... Federal law allows employers to pay tipped workers less than the minimum wage ($2.13 per hour instead of $7.25), but it explicitly says that when employers take advantage of this, they have to let employees keep their tips. Tipped employees can be required to share a tip pool among themselves, but the pool can’t include non-tipped employees or fund other expenses.

There is no such restriction, however, regarding businesses that pay all their employees the full minimum wage or higher. Their tipping systems are supposed to be regulated by the states, if at all. The Obama administration didn’t like this policy, so as was its wont, it made up a new one and declared it the law. According to a 2011 Labor Department regulation, all tips are the property of tipped employees — and no employer can set up a pool that includes non-tipped employees or funds other expenses..."

and the law itself:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/29/531.52

§ 531.52 General characteristics of “tips.”

A tip is a sum presented by a customer as a gift or gratuity in recognition of some service performed for him. It is to be distinguished from payment of a charge, if any, made for the service. Whether a tip is to be given, and its amount, are matters determined solely by the customer, who has the right to determine who shall be the recipient of the gratuity. Tips are the property of the employee whether or not the employer has taken a tip credit under section 3(m) of the FLSA. The employer is prohibited from using an employee's tips, whether or not it has taken a tip credit, for any reason other than that which is statutorily permitted in section 3(m): As a credit against its minimum wage obligations to the employee, or in furtherance of a valid tip pool. Only tips actually received by an employee as money belonging to the employee may be counted in determining whether the person is a “tipped employee” within the meaning of the Act and in applying the provisions of section 3(m) which govern wage credits for tips.

Now, Trump is trying to undo all of that and congress is likely going to do away with that law, especially if the Republicans take both the House and Senate, but for now the law stands...


... and that means you're wrong.
 
Golden said:
I have exclusively seen this shit expressed by broke men who have no business eating anything they themselves haven't cooked.
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konceptjones said:
https://www.nationalreview.com/2017...regulations-labor-department-makes-good-move/

"... Federal law allows employers to pay tipped workers less than the minimum wage ($2.13 per hour instead of $7.25), but it explicitly says that when employers take advantage of this, they have to let employees keep their tips. Tipped employees can be required to share a tip pool among themselves, but the pool can’t include non-tipped employees or fund other expenses.

There is no such restriction, however, regarding businesses that pay all their employees the full minimum wage or higher. Their tipping systems are supposed to be regulated by the states, if at all. The Obama administration didn’t like this policy, so as was its wont, it made up a new one and declared it the law. According to a 2011 Labor Department regulation, all tips are the property of tipped employees — and no employer can set up a pool that includes non-tipped employees or funds other expenses..."

and the law itself:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/29/531.52

§ 531.52 General characteristics of “tips.”

A tip is a sum presented by a customer as a gift or gratuity in recognition of some service performed for him. It is to be distinguished from payment of a charge, if any, made for the service. Whether a tip is to be given, and its amount, are matters determined solely by the customer, who has the right to determine who shall be the recipient of the gratuity. Tips are the property of the employee whether or not the employer has taken a tip credit under section 3(m) of the FLSA. The employer is prohibited from using an employee's tips, whether or not it has taken a tip credit, for any reason other than that which is statutorily permitted in section 3(m): As a credit against its minimum wage obligations to the employee, or in furtherance of a valid tip pool. Only tips actually received by an employee as money belonging to the employee may be counted in determining whether the person is a “tipped employee” within the meaning of the Act and in applying the provisions of section 3(m) which govern wage credits for tips.

Now, Trump is trying to undo all of that and congress is likely going to do away with that law, especially if the Republicans take both the House and Senate, but for now the law stands...


... and that means you're wrong.
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lol What the fuck does that even have to do with what I've been talking about?
 
The Lonious Monk said:
lol What the fuck does that even have to do with what I've been talking about?
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You said this:

The Lonious Monk said:
Restaurants aren't obligated to give servers all their tips either.
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The law says this:

The Department of Labor said:
Tips are the property of the employee whether or not the employer has taken a tip credit under section 3(m) of the FLSA. The employer is prohibited from using an employee's tips, whether or not it has taken a tip credit, for any reason other than that which is statutorily permitted in section 3(m): As a credit against its minimum wage obligations to the employee, or in furtherance of a valid tip pool.
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Ergo, you're dead ass wrong.
 
The Lonious Monk said:
Ok, congrats, you proved me wrong on a side point, that I don't really give a shit about and has very little to do with the primary discussion.
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What's really sad is that you don't get how integral it is to the whole point. You can't see the forest because of the trees in your way.

You brought this shit up, argued it, had nothing to back up your argument, and now after it's been proven wrong suddenly you didn't give a shit about it to begin with.

Typical.
 
konceptjones said:
What's really sad is that you don't get how integral it is to the whole point. You can't see the forest because of the trees in your way.

You brought this shit up, argued it, had nothing to back up your argument, and now after it's been proven wrong suddenly you didn't give a shit about it to begin with.

Typical.
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I didn't bring it up. I responded to something you said. I got what is in place now mixed up with what Trump is trying to do. I was wrong. That doesn't have anything to do with what I was originally talking about. You're putting up all these titangraphs and none of it changes the fact that what I'm saying is based on trends that are actually happening. None of that changes the fact that many of these restaurants that attempted to move away from tipping without adjusting their prices either failed or quickly abandoned the practice.

 
The Lonious Monk said:
I didn't bring it up. I responded to something you said. I got what is in place now mixed up with what Trump is trying to do. I was wrong. That doesn't have anything to do with what I was originally talking about. You're putting up all these titangraphs and none of it changes the fact that what I'm saying is based on trends that are actually happening. None of that changes the fact that many of these restaurants that attempted to move away from tipping without adjusting their prices either failed or quickly abandoned the practice.

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LOL @this interview with ONE dude that has a restaurant in one of the most expensive cities in the world being the voice for everyone. He even admits that he screwed it up!

Just admit you don't understand how a business works and be done with it. I could spot the flaws and misrepresentations in this dude's interview immediately. He ain't tellin the whole truth.
 
konceptjones said:
LOL @this interview with ONE dude that has a restaurant in one of the most expensive cities in the world being the voice for everyone. He even admits that he screwed it up!

Just admit you don't understand how a business works and be done with it. I could spot the flaws and misrepresentations in this dude's interview immediately. He ain't tellin the whole truth.
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Uh huh
 
Tipping is a disgrace.

Why am I obligated to provide charitable service to a waiter/waitress for? Who are u, a starving child in Cambodia? Nah, ur glorified plate carriers who are already paid by your employer. I'm just trying to eat the food made with craft and skill by the CHEFS. Lemme pay for my food and skedaddle.

I don't throw a dollar into a bank tellers hand for helping me deposit my money. Or to a barista for prepping my coffee. Y'all are doing what ur hired to do.

I work a service job myself. Where's my moolah? Oh yeah, it comes in a cheque every two weeks. Seems like this "social contract" is arbitrary as all hell.


My Theory: ?

Exploitative employers decided to opportunistically make tipping a matter of "social etiquette" in order to offset their own dearth of providing adequate wages.


And....


The sheer amount of famished simp niggas oggling their favourite waitress a lil too hard thought throwing em a bone in the form of a few bills could buy them some charm. Next thing u know, a horde of plate juggling hoes think they're entitled to my cash. Well biatch, think again.

Who's with me? Tipping can kick rocks.

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They should probably just standardize a service charge in the restaurant industry. That said, I prefer leaving it as tips because it gives you the freedom of not giving anything to someone who provided you shitty service.
 
Restaurants should pay their staff a decent wage and those wages would be reflected in the cost to dine there.

Having to rely on tipping to take home decent pay is wack. You could be a great server and do a great job but still get no tip cuz someone just aint feel like it.
 
Tipping is a way for owners to get around paying half their staff & servers dont want tipping to stop because they generally make a lot of money for not that difficult of a job. One study I saw ( i cant find it now) said servers generally make like 2.5 times more than back of the house staff. So any time the subject of tipping comes up, you have owners online lying saying they'd go out of business if they had to pay staff, because they make like no money (even tho other countries have restaurants, pay their staff and somehow stay open), then you have servers trying to shame you if you dont tip a high percentage( they constantly try and up it every year).

What I always find funny is the threads about tipping on reddit. All the servers flood it going on and on about how much their check is (conveniently leaving out the amount of tips they make) and how difficult of a job it is. But when people challenge them on said difficultly, they never have much to say, other than they have to stand a long time.

Whats interesting is the last time server pay was raised, was like 30 years ago. When they announced that they're planning on raising it, the restaurant industry used the same scare tactics they use today and other industries use for min wage. Talking about if its raised they'd have to fire people and go out of business, ect. They raised it anyway, to what it is now, then magically nothing happened after that.
 
The Lonious Monk said:
They should probably just standardize a service charge in the restaurant industry. That said, I prefer leaving it as tips because it gives you the freedom of not giving anything to someone who provided you shitty service.
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Fuck a service charge. That should already be factored into the price of the meal.
 
making the employees rely on tips is trash but i dont see anything wrong with the gesture of tipping at all

i've never had service that was sooo terrible and all the waiters fault....when you're waiting 30 mins thats the kitchen, not them

anyway there are a few restaurants that have figured out different ways to do it but I think a standard will fall into place at some point

everything has to evolve
 
Chi-town B said:
How much do y'all tip doordash and grubhub drivers?
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I've found tipping them prior to delivery doesn't guarantee any kind of good service.

So now I don't tip them anything.

I'm already paying a delivery fee and a service charge.

If anything there should be an option to tip after the fact like Lyft. No incentive to tip and they don't have to do anything to earn it as the system is.

I've tipped and then watched mfs move hella slow w my shit. Or leave the shit at my door no knock. One mf left it in the lobby on the floor talking about the buzz don't work. I think that was the last time I tipped.

Unless it's the restaurant's that use their own delivery drivers I'm not tipping.
 
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