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DMorgan said:
The shit Trump does and says and the support he gets for saying and doing it is as they say as american as apple pie.

People are being foolish to believe that america is better and above the shit that Trump says and does.
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There is truth to this.

But America is not a monolith.

We can change the status quo if we build a movement around the issues and elect a political leadership willing to do it.

It’s happened before. It can happen again
 
Peace_79 said:
There is truth to this.

But America is not a monolith.

We can change the status quo if we build a movement around the issues and elect a political leadership willing to do it.

It’s happened before. It can happen again
Click to expand...

I know its not a monolith which why I said Trump and his supporters meaning there is a group who doesn't support him.

This is where we disagree. Republicans don't want shit to change as far as status quo unless it goes back to the 1600s - 1930's. Democrats don't really want shit to change they really just want people to stop complaining and are willing to give folks enough crumbs for them to hopefully shut the fuck up.
 
DMorgan said:
I know its not a monolith which why I said Trump and his supporters meaning there is a group who doesn't support him.

This is where we disagree. Republicans don't want shit to change as far as status quo unless it goes back to the 1600s - 1930's. Democrats don't really want shit to change they really just want people to stop complaining and are willing to give folks enough crumbs for them to hopefully shut the fuck up.
Click to expand...


I think both parties want to go back to the 1600s to be honest.
 
Peace_79 said:
There is truth to this.

But America is not a monolith.

We can change the status quo if we build a movement around the issues and elect a political leadership willing to do it.

It’s happened before. It can happen again
Click to expand...
Shit when has the status quo changed... it just went into hiding or became more vociferous
 
DMorgan said:
I know its not a monolith which why I said Trump and his supporters meaning there is a group who doesn't support him.

This is where we disagree. Republicans don't want shit to change as far as status quo unless it goes back to the 1600s - 1930's. Democrats don't really want shit to change they really just want people to stop complaining and are willing to give folks enough crumbs for them to hopefully shut the fuck up.
Click to expand...


In your post you questioned whether or not “America” [as a whole] is “better than the shit that Trump says and does”.

The answer is “yes we are.”

Whether or not we choose to prove it with our votes is yet to be decided.

It’s why I alluded to the fact that America consists of millions of people and dozens of ideologies - a very large faction of which believe in Progressive values - or, in other words, the complete opposite of the bullshit we see in Washington.

Your take on Republicans is spot on and your take on the majority of Democrats is generally correct... with three notable caveats.

1 - The majority of Democrats have the capacity to be decent people who can work to accomplish good things on behalf of the American people

2 - The majority of Democrats “give us crumbs” because they are beholden to their corporate donors.

3 - The majority of Democrats will follow the powerful to remain in proximity to that power


So why don’t we -

  • Eliminate the influence of corporate money in politics so we can get more than “crumbs”

  • Crush the Republicans politically

  • Put the power in the hands of actual Progressives who work on behalf of the American people &

  • Work with the Democrats that are left to change the system so that it actually works for all Americans instead of just the 1%

This is why this “both sides”, ‘Kumbaya’, Play nice with Republicans bullshit is a horrible fucking strategy.

Joe Biden and status quo candidates are horrible fucking candidates.

But if one of them wins the primary, of course I am voting for them over a Republican. Because issue by issue, they move us forward in the right direction as opposed to taking ten steps backward.



This is, by definition, not a static system. We have agency over the outcomes that we see.
 
Focal Point said:
Shit when has the status quo changed... it just went into hiding or became more vociferous
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There has never been a revolution that completely wipes out systemic racism or reigns in the greed of capitalism.

But I would say the rights of marginalized groups have been significantly advanced since the 1700s... to say the least.

That status quo now, has evolved from the status quo then.
 
Peace_79 said:
In your post you questioned whether or not “America” [as a whole] is “better than the shit that Trump says and does”.

The answer is “yes we are.”

Whether or not we choose to prove it with our votes is yet to be decided.

It’s why I alluded to the fact that America consists of millions of people and dozens of ideologies - a very large faction of which believe in Progressive values - or, in other words, the complete opposite of the bullshit we see in Washington.

Your take on Republicans is spot on and your take on the majority of Democrats is generally correct... with three notable caveats.

1 - The majority of Democrats have the capacity to be decent people who can work to accomplish good things on behalf of the American people

2 - The majority of Democrats “give us crumbs” because they are beholden to their corporate donors.

3 - The majority of Democrats will follow the powerful to remain in proximity to that power


So why don’t we -

  • Eliminate the influence of corporate money in politics so we can get more than “crumbs”

  • Crush the Republicans politically

  • Put the power in the hands of actual Progressives who work on behalf of the American people &

  • Work with the Democrats that are left to change the system so that it actually works for all Americans instead of just the 1%

This is why this “both sides”, ‘Kumbaya’, Play nice with Republicans bullshit is a horrible fucking strategy.

Joe Biden and status quo candidates are horrible fucking candidates.

But if one of them wins the primary, of course I am voting for them over a Republican. Because issue by issue, they move us forward in the right direction as opposed to taking ten steps backward.



This is, by definition, not a static system. We have agency over the outcomes that we see.
Click to expand...

No america is not and it has NEVER in it's history shown that it is better than that.

This country is the epitome of actions speak louder than words.

Eliminating corporate money ain't going to happen because democrats benefit from that side of the game just as much as republicans do.

Democrats haven't shown me any reason to believe your first caveat.

Democrats give crumbs because they want to maintain white supremacy just as much as republicans do they just feel like it doesn't have to be done in as much as a harsh manner as republicans do.

It would make more sense to actually destroy the system seeing as though you recognize that both parties are corrupt.

Progressives have some nice ideas but I ain't sold on their shit either.

You seem to believe in the words that america has written down on paper about what it stands for. I don't believe in none of that shit. People seem to think in this country that the political, financial and judicial systems are broken. When in fact those systems are working just as they've been designed to work and the people who come from those who designed it are extremely happy with the way its working.

I'm not for continuing to try to integrate ourselves into this fucked up shit. That shit ain't going to work. IMO either destroy the system or shit is just going to continue to stay the same with very little real changes to truly help people coming from it.
 
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