a.mann
Active Member
There's no other group like ""us""
Which why this would not only be improbable but a logistical nightmare.
And sadly would cause more problems and confusion than solved anything...tangible
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The #ADOS Movement
- Thread starter The Hue
- Start date
There's no other group like ""us""
Which why this would not only be improbable but a logistical nightmare.
And sadly would cause more problems and confusion than solved anything...tangible
Soul_Rattler
Active Member
The fact is this.
Even if the legislative and executive branches came up with a solid plan for reparations, white people would find some way to fuck it up. And some black people will also find a way to fuck it up until the government just says fuck it, we tried.
Even if the legislative and executive branches came up with a solid plan for reparations, white people would find some way to fuck it up. And some black people will also find a way to fuck it up until the government just says fuck it, we tried.
The Lonious Monk
Celestial Souljah
Then it's this:
So if you had a choice between a candidate that has policies that will benefit your group among others vs a candidate that will likely only do your group harm, you'd abstain from voting? That makes sense to you?
That's how we got Trump in office. You think that was a good move?
Black Caesar
Active Member
Yes I think it was a good move. and so do MANY others. People aren't falling for the games anymore. If neither are going to do shit, why give them the vote, and rise them to power, without working? Does THAT make sense to you? That's being a sucker. The politicians are supposed to work for us, not the other way around. Other groups have figured this out a while ago.
Also, I'm not so concerned about OTHER groups getting benefits considering they've been getting benefits for DECADES, that we as a group should have been getting. How you're not upset about that is disturbing to me. I feel you need to realize that as a group it's time for us to be selfish, instead of always wanting to cape and take up other groups causes, then our group IS NOT extended the same courtesy. (Didn't see other groups as a whole come to our defense when cops were on a killing spree killing.) Hell the LGBTQ community who's group hasn't been around nearly as long as the black community are being offered tangibles, but when it comes to the black community, they try to hit us up with the the old "trickle down" effect which disperses, and dilutes the tangibles to everyone else, and by the time it gets to us, there isn't anything. Hell Nancy Pelosi just came with some bullshit the other day about a commission to "study black reparations". (You can read about it here: https://www.nationalreview.com/news...9xJ3jiNhwi8nF3fJqAfd0DYAFgYLrtw6sHOxDKn6lWNEA) This is another bullshit tactic/gesture, because the other groups didn't have a "study". They don't offer gays a bill to "study" gay rights or gay marriage. Nor do they need to "study" Jewish Holocaust reparations. The fact that the DEMS are scrambling to pander for the black votes is indicating that what we're doing IS WORKING, and now we have to double down, keep the pressure on them to MAKE them act.
I'm concerned about the survival of our group/community. (Not saying you're not.) Our group for survival needs to be like the other groups and be exclusive as opposed to be inclusive. That starts with us stepping our economic game up. (A whole other topic, but look up Dr. Claude Anderson on youtube for this topic.)
I feel that you subscribe to the "lesser of two evils" theory. Let me put to you plainly. EVIL IS EVIL. Also that "vote democrat, or the republicans will get you" has been a scare tactic used for DECADES. You fell for the banana in the tailpipe which a LOT of us did. (Myself included growing up.) Black people have been led to believe the democrats will look out but how has that worked out for our group? That's why they keep taking advantage. Watching what Cory Booker, Kamala Harris, and Bernie has said about reparations should have finally tipped you off. That's why I've been an INDEPENDENT for a while.
What you're witnessing now is the power that we as a group has. I know that's foreign to a lot of people, because some haven't witnessed or felt what having it is like. Yes it's not easy, and if you want change, you HAVE to be willing to fight for it.
That's how I feel about it, and I'm staying on my square about it. Hopefully this has given you some perspective. We DON'T HAVE to agree, but I given you a detailed answer, so there is no confusion from here on out about how I feel about this.
I'll leave with this. You're going to have to decide if you want to be on the right side of history or not. Mayweather, Kanye, Chrisette Michele, John Lewis, Maxine Waters, Dyson, Roland Martin, Ken Thompson and others have made their choice.
If you want to chop it up about other topics, it's all love.
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Black Caesar
Active Member
They're already trying to now by bullshitting. Nancy Pelosi is talking about commissioning a "study" for black reparations.
https://www.nationalreview.com/news...9xJ3jiNhwi8nF3fJqAfd0DYAFgYLrtw6sHOxDKn6lWNEA
The other groups didn't need a "study". Since they need to do a "study" then black society will "study" if we'll vote for her party.
The Lonious Monk
Celestial Souljah
Your priority is the uplifting of the black community. I respect that and have no problem with it or prioritizing black advocacy. That's fine. My problem is with the insistence of putting passion over intelligence in the moves people want to make. You say letting Trump in office was a good thing. Fine. Tell me how black people have benefited from that. Is our community in a better place now? Are we no guaranteed to get a candidate with a black agenda? I don't think so, but you have a different perspective so maybe I'm over looking something so help me understand how riding the pine and letting this fool in office helped black people.
Say the choice for the election comes down to Bernie vs Trump, I'm guessing you will sit it out because Bernie doesn't have a clear agenda for black people. You have that right, but again, how does that choice serve your interests or our people's interests? Bernie wants Medicare for All. Our community is one with the highest rates of uninsured. Bernie wants a living wage for all. Our community has the lowest average family income in the country. Bernie wants free college for everyone. Our community suffers from some of the lowest access to continuing education and biggest problems with student debt for those that do go to college. Bernie wants to end senseless wars. Our community has disproportionately provided fodder for these wars. Bernie wants to decrease wealth inequality. Our community has suffered from that more than any group in the country. No Bernie and most of the other progressive candidates don't have a platform that caters to black people, but almost everything they propose would disproportionately help black people due to our position in this country. How are you standing up for our community by making moves that could help put someone in office who doesn't want to do any of that and has no interest in making moves that will help the people at all? If you're goal is to help black people but you can't definitively nail down how your actions are helping black people, you have to take a hard look at your strategy.
The Lonious Monk
Celestial Souljah
What you're saying makes no sense. If you had just said you don't trust Nancy Pelosi and the democrats in charge, I'd be with you. However, the idea that they could just give black people reparations without conducting some kind of research into how that would be accomplished is silly. Ya'll keep bringing up what was done for other groups. What are you even talking about? The shit that was done for the Native Americans? To this day they might be the one group in the country that has it worse off than us. Do we really want the same "help?" You want the money they gave the Jewish Holocaust survivors/descendants? Will that chump change help Black America? It would basically amount to a big tax refund one year for everyone, and then back to the misery the next year. That's not how anything effective is done. Congress needs to put some research into what course of action would best undo the decades of damage perpetrated on black people and help lift us out of the quagmire. Of course, we need to hold their feet to the fire and make sure they actually do the research right and act accordingly on the findings, but walking away when they say they may do that research makes no sense.
It's like a worker going to HR at his company and making a case for why he should get a raise, and then quitting his job when HR agrees to perform an assessment to determine what compensation would be appropriate for his performance. How does that sound like a good idea to you?
Black Caesar
Active Member
How would Hilary Clinton being in office benefit us? She and her husband were "3 strikes". I take it you didn't read the leaked emails a few years back, concerning how the democrats should deal with black issues. The politicians have had a habit for using "benign neglect", yet you choose to ignore this fact. Also you ignored the fact that I stated that we need to as a group look out for our OWN interests. You can't do that when you want the candidates to be inclusive because it will never benefit our group. Just study the past and see this. Nothing has trickled down in our favor. AGAIN I have EXPLAINED this in the previous post. Every OTHER group gets exclusive tangibles accept US. This is not the "We Are The World, We Are The Children" song. Again you want to ignore this fact.
Oh Bernie DOES had have an agenda for black people and it's to DO NOTHING. Bernie doesn't support black reparations. Did you not see the video that I posted about this? There is even video going back to 2016 stating the same thing in greater detail. (You can look a youtube for it yourself.) HE IS NOT A FRIEND OF BLACK PEOPLE. Why is it that you can't see that? Bernie is the same like the others. When a politician uses the words "all and "everybody" when asked about what they're going to do for specific groups, it's a clear warning sign that they have no intentions of tangibles with that said group. Guess which group gets hit with this? Yep US. Not the Hispanics, not the LBGTQ, not other groups but us. So Bernie wants to decrease wealth inequality, doesn't want black people to have reparations, but YET he supports the "Just Act" bill. (S.447 - Justice for Uncompensated Survivors Today Act of 2017.) This bill gives MORE reparations to the Jewish community, which by the way the Holocaust didn't happen in the States! So, if he was so "concerned" about decreasing wealth inequality, why is his community set up to get more while we get nothing? Intelligence and the evidence of this bill that he supports should tell you that it's a conflict of interest and therefore IS A LIE. There is NO EXCUSE with this bill out there that he SUPPORTS trying to get passed. Use your logic. That doesn't sound like he's trying to decrease wealth inequality does it?
Are we guaranteed to get a candidate with a black agenda? No. Just like the politicians are not guaranteed to get our votes, if they can't give us something in exchange. It's called "Quid Quo Pro". WE WILL NOT BE TAKEN ADVANTAGED OF ANYMORE. WE OFF THAT.
Only one candidate so far has spoke about a black agenda, reparations with numbers behind it and that's Marianne-Williamson. I'm waiting to hear her explain in greater detail, before I make a decision on her, but unlike the other candidates, she didn't have to be forced or double talk around the issue.
As for my "strategy" it seems that it's not mine and others that should be questioned, but your own. From what I'm gathering, your strategy is based on something intangible called "hope" like the pastors give the congregation every Sunday in exchange for money. The strategy that others and myself HAS been working is evident as of late. Politicians are now being held accountable. You never heard the politicians speak on the issue of reparations before have you? NOPE, and they hate it. That's why Bernie, Kamala, and Cory Booker were frustrated about it. Why do you hate the fact that we as a group are demanding something in exchange for our votes, that could help us out and give us the ability to compete with other groups? It's sounds like you just want us to keep doing the same thing over again expecting a different result. That's called insanity, not a strategy.
Us as a group still have to build our economic base up, but what's happening now is incredible. This is just the beginning.
So that's it. I feel I've spoken to you enough about this subject. Again we don't have to agree and I'm not going to change my opinion, just as much as I'm not going to change yours. Our views are not aligned on this subject and that's ok as long as the discourse is there to get our people talking and trying to rise like we should by taking ACTION. Again, only YOU can decide what side of history you want to be on.
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The Lonious Monk
Celestial Souljah
Believe what you want, but stop with the "You can decides what side of history you want to be on" nonsense. You can't even explain how your actions will help black people, so stop acting like you're making some kind of strong stance that will mean the difference between our success or failure. I'm not trying to change your mind. I'm trying to get you to explain how what you're proposing helps us. You claimed that letting Trump in office was a good thing, but you still haven't explained how. No Clinton would not have been a friend of black people, but she wouldn't have gutted healthcare or redistributed wealth through tax cuts like Trump, two moves that have demonstrably hurt poor and middle class blacks.
You believe reparations is the hill that we should die on, ok. Trump doesn't believe in that, so he's not going to do that. Most of the democrats campaigning don't believe in it either so they likely won't do it. So once again, you'll sit the sideline. If Trump wins again, he'll do more damage and the country will flock to a democrat whoever it is just like they did with Obama. Most likely, the country has already had enough of Trump. The next president will probably be a democrat. If that happens and we sat out as you suggest, then all we will have done is prove to them that they can win without us. That would essentially ruin whatever little leverage we had going forward. If my assessment is wrong. Correct me.
Also, what tangibles are you talking about groups like the LBGT community is getting? They've been fighting for a long time and are only now getting rights that allow them to marry who they want and adopt who they want and not get beaten or discriminated against with impunity. You're right. We're not getting those tangibles because we got them 50 fucking years ago.
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deadeye
Warrior
This is really what the movement is about.
On the surface, it seems to be about getting us reparations.
Beneath the surface, however, it's about exposing the Democratic Party.
Basically trying to get black people to wake up and realize that they're only using us for our votes and have no intention of giving us anything in return.
Mister
Ignorance can be remedied. Stupidity is incurable.
So the answer is to give up the right to vote? The racists won't even have to worry about voter suppression. We'll do the job for them.
deadeye
Warrior
Mister
Ignorance can be remedied. Stupidity is incurable.
Well the person you quoted has said exactly that. No vote if there isn't a specific black agenda.
a.mann
Active Member
Funny huh?
How they say they are against Trump and the Republican agenda, e.g.. gutting healthcare,more tax breaks for the wealthy,cutting education funding, busting union jobs, raising of the minimum wage,student loan reform etc,etc.
But damn near everything they do only helps to advance this ""conservative" agenda
Elzo69Renaissance
I dare one of you niggas to scream No Diddy!
The point is if ur able to you vote and then u vote against Trump