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HipHop Hasn't Done Anything Good For Black People

Dwayne said:
That’s not how this works.

The music you consume and the overall music that’s being made and fed to the masses are not connected.
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Unless youre saying its not actually real then yes the music is connected.

You're in a time where you have more options than ever on what music and anything else hip hop related to consume. Yes some things are pushed more than others but you van simply choose not to listen to it. And by the actual numbers alot of those artists people think are big aren't that big at all. They can't sell albums, they can't sell out shows, they have no actual talent. They're personalities more than anything else. The actual most successful people in Hip Hop aren't the ones you probably think. The most listened to artists probably aren't who most people think they are.

You can't tell somebody else what they're consuming isn't real just because it's not what you're experiencing.
 
BlackRain said:
Lol at rap being to blame for the lack of more Black people in these professions. Because 50 years of hip hop is more influential than hundreds of years of racism and policies and laws being created literally keeping Black folks ability to be upwardly mobile hindered.
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Man, why are you doing this? I never said such a thing. It is, emphatically, not more influential.

This is just a stray man. That means that you deliberately being dishonest.
 
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loud-ninja said:
Your opinion doesn't matter in the grand scheme off things. It is such a weak argument. Give facts or don't debate.

Remove arts, sports, or entertainment and we may have more folks in the careers you stated. See how weak your argument is? Most kids who graduate from high-school are not becoming rappers or is in that field. So it is obviously more main issues that weigh higher.

I honestly think social media is a bigger concern then hip hop. That is why you see a lot of states trying to make laws to combat the influence it has on the youth.

Out of all the issues that kids go through, do you really think hip hop is a main issue to kids not going into those careers? Or is it a minuscule issue that won't have a huge impact if addressed?

1.Get parents more involved in their kid's education at home. This allows parents to nurture their kid/s interest. Starts at home.

2.Get schools more funding so they can have programs dedicated to certain fields. Like computer programming classes.

3.Get teachers to engage more with black kids and get rid of these racist teachers.

4. Get more qualified teachers
5. Find ways to reduce burnout for teachers.

6. Get school funding to provide better counciling for mental health for the at risk students. Depression is on the rise for kids.

Do you think the removal of hip hop would have a bigger effect then some of the issues I provided? I'm not gonna get into the poverty and trauma that some kids experience at home.
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These particular points might not, but some others (including some of what you say here, as well as some others) probably could have a bigger effect, and in particular, counter the negative effects of hip hop on academic engagement.

So my position is not that the negative effect of hip hop can't be overcome.

But that doesn't mean that it doesn't have a negative effect on academic achievement.
 
Gray Matter said:
Folks, if someone says that hip hop is a problem, that doesn't mean that they believe that it is the only problem.

This is obvious and shouldn't need to be said.
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The problem is when anything negative happens and hip hop is the reason behind it, you lose the opportunity to add nuance

Hip hop is A problem is a totally different opinion from hip hop is THE problem

The problem in this thread is the latter is being said while trying to phrase it like the former.

It's the "you know what I'm trying to say"

Well actually I don't because you are conflating issues
 
AP3.0 said:
The problem is when anything negative happens and hip hop is the reason behind it, you lose the opportunity to add nuance

Hip hop is A problem is a totally different opinion from hip hop is THE problem

The problem in this thread is the latter is being said while trying to phrase it like the former.

It's the "you know what I'm trying to say"

Well actually I don't because you are conflating issues
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Nobody in here ever said hip hop IS the problem. Not one person
 
AP3.0 said:
The problem is when anything negative happens and hip hop is the reason behind it, you lose the opportunity to add nuance

Hip hop is A problem is a totally different opinion from hip hop is THE problem

The problem in this thread is the latter is being said while trying to phrase it like the former.

It's the "you know what I'm trying to say"

Well actually I don't because you are conflating issues
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Who has said hiphop is the problem with the black community tho?
 
Gray Matter said:
Man, why are you doing this? I never said such a thing. It is, emphatically, is not more influential.

This is just a stray man. That means that you deliberately being dishonest.
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Well I never said you claimed it was the only thing...but you did say this in your first few words...

In my opinion, without hip hop black people would have more accountants, marketing specialists, computer programmers, doctors, agricultural inspectors, biologists, architects, professors, dentists, astronomers, lawyers, psychologists, dentists, economists, IT managers, health inspectors, librarians, financial managers, pharmacists, teachers, mathematicians, eye doctors, neurologists, political scientists, entrepreneurs, radiologists, zoologists, and so on and so on. This means that there will be less people who need help. A more educated black population would be better off in general, even if no one helped anyone any more than they now do.
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So yeah you're not only not even being true to what you said but you're still being dishonest in your measure of hip hop over 50 years vs things that have been in place for centuries
 
AP3.0 said:
The problem is when anything negative happens and hip hop is the reason behind it, you lose the opportunity to add nuance

Hip hop is A problem is a totally different opinion from hip hop is THE problem

The problem in this thread is the latter is being said while trying to phrase it like the former.

It's the "you know what I'm trying to say"

Well actually I don't because you are conflating issues
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Hip hop is a problem, but if there is a 'the problem' it is white racism, including past racism.

Everything I say, at least, should be understood in light of this.

Hope this is clear now to everyone.
 
One day we are going to learn that words have meaning for a reason. If a public speaker spoke like some of yall, yall would have problems. Blanket statements mean "all". If you don't mean "all", you should use other key words to make your point. Key words such as: some, few, many, most, i think, most likely, etc.

No one knows anyone on here, so no, we don't know what you truly mean. We are gonna go by what you wrote. Be clear in your speech and you won't lose your audience. It's really that simple.
 
BlackRain said:
Well I never said you claimed it was the only thing...but you did say this in your first few words...



So yeah you're not only not even being true to what you said but you're still being dishonest in your measure of hip hop over 50 years vs things that have been in place for centuries
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How am I not being true to what I said? And how am I being dishonest?

I bet that you're simply confused and are ascribing views to me that are not implied by what I said.
 
loud-ninja said:
One day we are going to learn that words have meaning for a reason. If a public speaker spoke like some of yall, yall would have problems. Blanket statements mean "all". If you don't mean "all", you should use other key words to make your point. Key words such as: some, few, many, most, i think, most likely, etc.

No one knows anyone on here, so no, we don't know what you truly mean. We are gonna go by what you wrote. Be clear in your speech and you won't lose your audience. It's really that simple.
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Is it not obvious I'm not talking about lecrae or larussel when I say...

Hiphop
:js4:

You couldn't make that distinction? That's peace.
 
TTBF said:
Is it not obvious I'm not talking about lecrae or larussel when I say...

Hiphop
:js4:

You couldn't make that distinction? That's peace.
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I have no idea what you are talking about with your example. I saw both sides saying "did I say all?" Or give blanket statements all through this thread. So obviously, certain things are not as obvious as one would think.

Not really that hard to be clear in one's speech.
 
BlackRain said:
Yes it does. I never said that's all it stresses but you're not acting in good faith if you say it doesn't. To whatever degree depends on what you consume from the culture overall. But you can't say those things aren't promoted and stressed within hip hop.
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So here’s the thing: If we’re analyzing the values and cultural norms of Hip Hop culture it’s always going to be somewhat subjective. However, if we're discussing what the values of the culture as a whole are, you supporting your claim with your subjective, anecdotal, and personal experience with the culture is inadequate. You've been leaning heavily on the "individual/individuals" to support your argument this entire discussion and that's just too narrow of a lens if the subject of the convo is the affects/benefits/harms on the "community".

To support my claim that some main values of Hip-Hop"culture are promiscuity, normalization of violence to resolve interpersonal conflicts, and shallow materialism, we can pull the lyrics from the most popularly stramed Hip Hop Songs from the past few years and break down the themes.

We can pull the transcripts from recent episodes of the most popular Hip Hop media(ie. The Breakfast Club, Joe Budden Podcast, Vladtv, etc.) and analyze the discussion topics. We can look at how these topics are framed.

We can list the most popular and influential films of Hip Hop culture and revisit what the themes of said films were.

We can do that if you're willing to be honest...I'm not sure you are. It may be true that you listen to rap about the importance of education and helping old ladies across the street but that's just not enough to say THAT'S what hip hop culture is about.
 
OBVIOUSLY Black people were dealt a shitty hand in this country. Adopting the values that are promoted by contemporary Hip Hop culture is us playing a shitty hand poorly. It's not enough to say that Hip-Hop made some Black people rich; so did the Trans-Atlantic Slave trade.

Had it not been for Hip-Hop, Black millionaires would have been created through other means. There were Black millionaires that existed in this country WHILE slavery was going on. Black people would've found ways just like we did before and perhaps without the negative effects of Hip-Hop that y'all are acknowledging but downplaying.
 
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