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COMMUNITY The Official 2024 Presidential Election Thread

Added to Calendar: 11-05-24

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Stiff said:
This guy was personally a member of the organization currently carrying out one of the most substantial genocides of the 21st century and you have people in here talking “lesser of two evils” cheering him on as a possible VP contender . Disgusting.
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His selection (as opposed to a different selection) would be a setback for the Palestinians going forward, but a Harris/Shapiro ticket would be the lesser evil as far as they are concerned. Explain why you don't think they would be. Usually, when people say this, they don't know what lesser evil means.
 
Gray Matter said:
His selection (as opposed to a different selection) would be a setback for the Palestinians going forward, but a Harris/Shapiro ticket would be the lesser evil as far as they are concerned. Explain why you don't think they would be. Usually, when people say this, they don't know what lesser evil means.
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On this issue especially I don’t think either ticket would be any “less evil” than the other. Trump and JD Vance are obviously both trash and we know Trump’s record of appeasement to Israel’s interests.

Kamala herself has cozy ties to AIPAC ( she gave a speech to them early after being elected to the senate). Her husband is Jewish and she’s been back and forth to Israel multiple times. Her very first act as senator was to sponsor a resolution that condemned a United Nations Security Council resolution that condemned Israel.

She’ll make some comments here and there that are tantamount to “maybe Israel should consider slowing down killing babies?”, but there’s no indication that she’ll depart from what has been the standard stance of the U.S government regarding Israel: unconditional support. More lip service and vague mentions of “two-state solution” while increasing numbers of Palestinians are displaced and murdered in the West Bank and massacred in Gaza with the tacit approval and funding of the U.S government.

“Not supporting genocide and an apartheid regime with our tax dollars” won’t be on the ballot this fall.
 
Stiff said:
On this issue especially I don’t think either ticket would be any “less evil” than the other. Trump and JD Vance are obviously both trash and we know Trump’s record of appeasement to Israel’s interests.

Kamala herself has cozy ties to AIPAC ( she gave a speech to them early after being elected to the senate). Her husband is Jewish and she’s been back and forth to Israel multiple times. Her very first act as senator was to sponsor a resolution that condemned a United Nations Security Council resolution that condemned Israel.

She’ll make some comments here and there that are tantamount to “maybe Israel should consider slowing down killing babies?”, but there’s no indication that she’ll depart from what has been the standard stance of the U.S government regarding Israel: unconditional support. More lip service and vague mentions of “two-state solution” while increasing numbers of Palestinians are displaced and murdered in the West Bank and massacred in Gaza with the tacit approval and funding of the U.S government.

“Not supporting genocide and an apartheid regime with our tax dollars” won’t be on the ballot this fall.
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Just as I thought. You don't know what "lesser evil" means.

After all, you said little about what would happen to Palestinians if Trump/Vance were elected.
 
Gray Matter said:
Just as I thought. You don't know what "lesser evil" means.

After all, you said little about what would happen to Palestinians if Trump/Vance were elected.
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Yeah that’s the thing—I genuinely believe there will be no material difference in what happens to Palestinians regardless of who is elected if history is any indicator.

Weapons and money will keep flowing in from our tax dollars to prop up the Israeli war machine without condition. What do you believe the difference will be and what leads you to believe that?
 
Stiff said:
Yeah that’s the thing—I genuinely believe there will be no material difference in what happens to Palestinians regardless of who is elected if history is any indicator.

Weapons and money will keep flowing in from our tax dollars to prop up the Israeli war machine without condition. What do you believe the difference will be and what leads you to believe that?
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I'll mention one thing. If Trump/Vance are elected, a (most likely permanent) mass population transfer (aka ethnic cleansing) of Gazans is possible, maybe even likely. But there is very little chance of that happening if Harris/Shapiro are elected.
 
Gray Matter said:
I'll mention one thing. If Trump/Vance are elected, a (most likely permanent) mass population transfer (aka ethnic cleansing) of Gazans is possible, maybe even likely. But there is very little chance of that happening if Harris/Shapiro are elected.
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The Biden/Harris administration just allowed/supported and continues to support a genocide.

If Israel decides they want to proceed with mass expulsions of the Gazan population, what in either Harris’s or Shapiro’s background leads you to believe their response would be substantially different than the Biden/Harris response to the genocide in Gaza?
 
Stiff said:
The Biden/Harris administration just allowed/supported and continues to support a genocide.

If Israel decides they want to proceed with mass expulsions of the Gazan population, what in either Harris’s or Shapiro’s background leads you to believe their response would be substantially different than the Biden/Harris response to the genocide in Gaza?
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Bruh, if it were not for Biden, Gazans would already be in Egypt. Netanyahu and co were openly talking about it late last year. But Biden's made it clear to Netanyahu that that is complete non-starter. Gazans will return to their homes after the war is done.

So even Biden/Harris are a lesser evil than Trump/Vance.

Even the conduct of the war (as bad as it has been) would be worse if Trump/Vance were in office, putting aide the possible ethnic cleansing. To mention just one thing, the Biden admin seems to have affected the size of bombs that Israel uses to bomb Gaza. They don't use those unguided 2000lbs bombs regularly the way they did early on.

Trump and Vance probably wouldn't have said shit.
 
Gray Matter said:
Bruh, if it were not for Biden, Gazans would already be in Egypt. Netanyahu and co were openly talking about it late last year. But Biden's made it clear to Netanyahu that that is complete non-starter. Gazans will return to their homes after the war is done.

So even Biden/Harris are a lesser evil than Trump/Vance.

Even the conduct of the war (as bad as it has been) would be worse if Trump/Vance were in office, putting aide the possible ethnic cleansing. To mention just one thing, the Biden admin seems to have affected the size of bombs that Israel uses to bomb Gaza. They don't use those unguided 2000lbs bombs regularly the way they did early on.

Trump and Vance probably wouldn't have said shit.
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You think Egypt, a sovereign nation that enforces its own borders would have sat by passively while 2 million refugees were forced on them when their economy is already on the brink? That was never plausible.

I don’t consider them refusing to give them 2000 lb bombs but instead giving them 4x the amount of unguided 500 lb cluster bombs anything to be proud of.
 
Stiff said:
You think Egypt, a sovereign nation that enforces its own borders would have sat by passively while 2 million refugees were forced on them when their economy is already on the brink? That was never plausible.

I don’t consider them refusing to give them 2000 lb bombs but instead giving them 4x the amount of unguided 500 lb cluster bombs anything to be proud of.
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That's not the point. To be sure though, Egypt would have resisted. Would it have stood its ground. I'm not sure. Anyway, the point is that Netanyahu has put the population transfer aside because of Biden's opposition.

Again, you've misunderstood my point. I'm not talking about what the US has or has not provided in terms of arms shipments. They put pressure on the Israelis behind closed doors and the Israelis changed the way that they were conducting the war. (Which, mind you, is still horrendously bad.)
 
Gray Matter said:
For Trump, black people are always "low IQ," "not smart," "dumb," etc. His low view of blacks could not be clearer.



Look at the all the black folks behind him. SMH.
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And that’s the two ironies about this:

1) He is a very stupid muhfucka if you listen to him.

2) There are scores of black people that flock to this fuckin doof, and actually agree with him.
 
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Gray Matter said:
That's not the point. To be sure though, Egypt would have resisted. Would it have stood its ground. I'm not sure. Anyway, the point is that Netanyahu has put the population transfer aside because of Biden's opposition.

Again, you've misunderstood my point. I'm not talking about what the US has or has not provided in terms of arms shipments. They put pressure on the Israelis behind closed doors and the Israelis changed the way that they were conducting the war. (Which, mind you, is still horrendously bad.)
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Eh I gotta disagree man

The bar u are claiming is already very low. Gazans will get to return home...when? Where? The place is leveled. They've been attacked by IDF when they tried to get back to their homes in northern Gaza.

ICC already issued arrest warrants for war crimes by netanyahu just as they did for Hamas leaders.

And this whole, they could've got pushed to egypt under trump....that's speculation for one, and secondly, even if it was true, how is it worse that u move a whole population elsewhere vs just killing as many as possible where they're at lol.

There's no lesser evil just different evils.
 
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