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Sting sues juice wrld over lucid dreams

Achewon87 said:
Stings a vulture tho...
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How is he a vulture? He has collaborated with people from a variety of musical genres, but it's not like he presents himself as an artist in that genre. For example, he recently did an album with Shaggy. He wasn't going around trying to claim he was a Reggae artist. As far as I've seen, he's always given credit where its due when it comes to the influence of other genre's of music on his own work.
 
Revolver Ocelot said:
From my understanding this is an example of interpolating.





Tribe didn't sample Good Love in the traditional sense, they just used Anita's cadence in their song.
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This is also an interpolation:



This is the original:



The guitar riff from "Strawberry Letter 23" was replayed with a different instrument and slowed down. That is the typical interpolation in hip hop. A lot of Dr Dre's shit from The Chronic were also interpolations, not samples, which is why you see a lot of different artists credited but while the melodies sound the same the instrumentation is a lot different i.e. Fuck With Dre Day interpolates the bassline from Funkadelic's Not Just Knee Deep.
 
What's the logic behind that interpolation shit? Why would playing something be any less theft than sampling? I could see decreasing what a person is owed, but saying they are owed nothing when you're still using their intellectual property sounds like BS.
 
CeLLar-DooR said:
its when you replay part of a song as opposed to choppin'. I was under the impression that interpolation cuts out the samplin' police, but I guess not.
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Ah i see. Still dumb of dude, you cant play an almost exact Riff of a famous song and expect them not to come for you lmao.
 
The Lonious Monk said:
What's the logic behind that interpolation shit? Why would playing something be any less theft than sampling? I could see decreasing what a person is owed, but saying they are owed nothing when you're still using their intellectual property sounds like BS.
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I laid it out already but here's how copyright law works when it comes to interpolations.

When you replay, in part or in whole, a piece of previously recorded music you only need to submit a form to the original artist for a Mechanical License stating that you intend to use that music in your own composition or as a cover of their original work. You're granted a compulsory license for that piece of music when you do this. The original artist cannot legally deny this license, they just have to roll with it whether they like it or not.

What then happens is that for every song you have that's either a cover or has an interpolated piece in it, you/your label pays the original artist 9.1 cents per track you use that piece of music in, per unit sold. So, if I were to interpolate the guitar riff from the same song of Sting's and then release that song for every copy I sell, whether physical or paid download, I owe Sting 9.1 cents so if I've sold 10,000 copies I owe dude $910.
 
konceptjones said:
I laid it out already but here's how copyright law works when it comes to interpolations.

When you replay, in part or in whole, a piece of previously recorded music you only need to submit a form to the original artist for a Mechanical License stating that you intend to use that music in your own composition or as a cover of their original work. You're granted a compulsory license for that piece of music when you do this. The original artist cannot legally deny this license, they just have to roll with it whether they like it or not.

What then happens is that for every song you have that's either a cover or has an interpolated piece in it, you/your label pays the original artist 9.1 cents per track you use that piece of music in, per unit sold. So, if I were to interpolate the guitar riff from the same song of Sting's and then release that song for every copy I sell, whether physical or paid download, I owe Sting 9.1 cents so if I've sold 10,000 copies I owe dude $910.
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Nah, I read what you said and get how it works. I just don't understand the logic of making a legal distinction between sampling and interpolating. They are just two different ways of doing the same thing.
 
The Lonious Monk said:
Nah, I read what you said and get how it works. I just don't understand the logic of making a legal distinction between sampling and interpolating. They are just two different ways of doing the same thing.
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No, they're really different.

Sampling is taking a digital recording of an original song and using it.
Interpolation is replaying a part of that song or the whole song as you would do in the case of doing a cover song.
 
konceptjones said:
No, they're really different.

Sampling is taking a digital recording of an original song and using it.
Interpolation is replaying a part of that song or the whole song as you would do in the case of doing a cover song.
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Yeah, but my point is that in either case, you're taking someone's intellectual property and using it to generate your own profit. Why should there be a substantial difference how much the originators is due? Also Hip Hop's use of interpolation is a little different than performing a cover song. For cover songs, it's basically acknowledged that the artist is performing someone else's work. In Hip Hop, the artist is supposedly making their own work that borrows some from another artist. You raise a good point though. From a money stand point, how does someone covering a song (.e.g., Fugees Killing me Softly) compare to a normal sample. I know you broke down how much an artist is paid for an interpolation, but how does that compare on average to what artist get for samples?
 
The Lonious Monk said:
Yeah, but my point is that in either case, you're taking someone's intellectual property and using it to generate your own profit. Why should there be a substantial difference how much the originators is due? Also Hip Hop's use of interpolation is a little different than performing a cover song. For cover songs, it's basically acknowledged that the artist is performing someone else's work. In Hip Hop, the artist is supposedly making their own work that borrows some from another artist. You raise a good point though. From a money stand point, how does someone covering a song (.e.g., Fugees Killing me Softly) compare to a normal sample. I know you broke down how much an artist is paid for an interpolation, but how does that compare on average to what artist get for samples?
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Because you're using the original work in a sample they can charge pretty much whatever they want for it or deny you the ability to use it at all. And that's the key to it: Sampling uses the original artist's original recording, the music that was recorded in the studio, then mastered by a competent mastering engineer.

When you interpolate, you're recreating that piece but unless you're extremely skilled you really can't recreate the "feel" of that piece.

Plus, when you interpolate you have to give credit to the original artist and whatever comes along with that goes to the original artist as well i.e. Grammy nominations and awards, Oscar's, etc.
 
konceptjones said:
Because you're using the original work in a sample they can charge pretty much whatever they want for it or deny you the ability to use it at all. And that's the key to it: Sampling uses the original artist's original recording, the music that was recorded in the studio, then mastered by a competent mastering engineer.

When you interpolate, you're recreating that piece but unless you're extremely skilled you really can't recreate the "feel" of that piece.

Plus, when you interpolate you have to give credit to the original artist and whatever comes along with that goes to the original artist as well i.e. Grammy nominations and awards, Oscar's, etc.
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I guess that makes sense, especially the last part. I wonder why Hip Hop producers didn't stop sampling immediately after the lawsuits came. It seems to me they could have been paying people to play parts of music and then sampling those parts a long time ago.
 
The Lonious Monk said:
I guess that makes sense, especially the last part. I wonder why Hip Hop producers didn't stop sampling immediately after the lawsuits came. It seems to me they could have been paying people to play parts of music and then sampling those parts a long time ago.
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Because, while sampling is an art form unto itself, replaying whole compositions takes an enormous amount of skill to pull off reasonably well. I've done it a few times for simple melodies or when something I had sampled had parts of the timing off and I couldn't get it right so I replayed it, but there's no way I'm gonna front like I could recreate something like, say, Billy Cobham's "Heather", Phillip Glass' "Lady Day", or The Gainsborough Gallery's "I Think I'll Catch a Bus".
 
konceptjones said:
Because, while sampling is an art form unto itself, replaying whole compositions takes an enormous amount of skill to pull off reasonably well. I've done it a few times for simple melodies or when something I had sampled had parts of the timing off and I couldn't get it right so I replayed it, but there's no way I'm gonna front like I could recreate something like, say, Billy Cobham's "Heather", Phillip Glass' "Lady Day", or The Gainsborough Gallery's "I Think I'll Catch a Bus".
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That's a good point.
 
KINGEC said:
Here's the producer showing the replaying of it

2:00 - 3:20

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So then this makes all that tuff talk even more suspicious 'cause, as I've already said, an interpolation doesn't need clearance, just a notice sent to the original artist.
 
konceptjones said:
So then this makes all that tuff talk even more suspicious 'cause, as I've already said, an interpolation doesn't need clearance, just a notice sent to the original artist.
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Yea but it’s also to said artist s discretion how to take it....see Marvin Gaye s estate
 
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