COMMUNITY Raising minimum wage and universal basic income. Are these bad things?

[AZTG]

How long can you keep minimum wage the same? Inflation averages 3% a year. Cant just have everything go up 3% every year but wages remain the same.

The idea behind a minimum wage is that it should be the least amount of money that a person can earn to survive on. And the current minimum wage isnt enough, so it needs to be increased.

There isnt any real argument against it

 

[ImaInfluenza]

There are already risk factors at play for doing a poor job. Getting suspended up until the point of termination if you repeatedly fail. Fast food restaurants expect more or less the same duties across the board. How is say, 2 dollars extra pay making anyone do a better job if the same standards of employee conduct are expected?

Got to burger and then got to chic fila and tell me it dont make a difference

 

[AZTG]

I dont see a problem with raising the minimum but all these companies will do is cut hours. So you will be working less but bringing home the same money. So you are still going to struggle.

Why would companies do that? They still have to fill their 8 hour shifts. So why pay me for 4 hours and pay you for 4 hours instead of paying either one of us for the full 8? Thats more expense for them when it comes to training and book keeping just to fill the same 8 hour shift.

So nah they wont cut hours.

 

[ChicagoFigure]

I think it should be adjusted state by state basis rather than just a flat rate across the country

 

[AZTG]

I would understand if the price of everything remained the same and we were just raising wages. I could see how that would be a problem.

Thats not happening though. The cost of living is going up way faster than peoples incomes.

How could the price of everything go up but the price of my labor stay the same?

And btw $15 isnt a fix, its a start. In 10 years $15 wont be enough either.

The minimum wage should go up yearly at the same rate as whatever the rate of inflation was for that year.

 

[loud-ninja]

Why would companies do that? They still have to fill their 8 hour shifts. So why pay me for 4 hours and pay you for 4 hours instead of paying either one of us for the full 8? Thats more expense for them when it comes to training and book keeping just to fill the same 8 hour shift.

So nah they wont cut hours.

Retail places cut hours for less. I am a good 8 or 9 yrs removed from when i use to work at kmart or any retail job. Hours were always getting cut. At least for part time workers. What they Don is have 1 person work like 2 different areas sometimes. Or they will just let some people go.

 

[AZTG]

If you ran a multi-billion dollar company, no way would you be ok with being compensated the same as the workers at entry level. And there's no way to quantify what's fair to pay each tier because everyone wants more and you'll have people who demands to be compensated more than one person or will view hard work differently than the other.

Theres laws in other countries that limit how much more a ceo can make than the bottom tier worker of a company.

I think the limits are like 15 times. So a ceo can only make 15 times as much as the lowest paid worker.

This has nothing to do with how much profit the owner of a company can make. Your profits are your profits. But for the role of the ceo you can only get paid a certain amount.

As always the US is way behind on this shit.

 

[LurkerSix]

The only problem with making all jobs a base pay of 15 dollars. Is that it lowers the incentive to do a good job...hear me out.

So, when you go to Wendy's, theres an expectation that you have of the service you expect to get..at the very worst.

When you go to chic filla, theres an expectation that you have of the service you expect to get...at the very worst.

Chic Fila routinely pays its employees better than Wendy's employees. But that comes with an expectation of how they want an employee to behave.

So if you want to right now get paid more while working at fast food. The skillset that chic fila demands, requires you to be that, so there is an incentive to do a good job. Cause even though it's not alot, it's more than you would get someone where else for the same type of job.

Now Wendy's, just expects you to be relatively competent and show up. Which is why the pay matches the expectations. Yet instill, Wendy's pays more than burger kind because Burger King demands even less than Wendy's. So even with the price Wendy's pays its employees. The incentive is that you dont want to end up at burger for the same type of work.

If the base pay for Wendy's and Burger King becomes the base pay for chic fila. Where is the incentive of the Wendy's employee to do a good job, when they can quit, get fired, and find another job of the same exact pay.

Wheres the incentive of the chic fila worker to put up with the demanded act, when they can go to Wendy's, make the same thing and get asked to do less.

The market has to correct itself right? Incentives have to be there, so now, chic fila goes up to something like 18 or 20 dollars. Well...now you looking at the pay for someone working entry level work as an electrician.

Those employees gonna be pushing to make more than a employee at chic fila due to the demand of the job and so on and so on...

So the domino affect isnt that it just raises the price of a burger by a dollar or so..it swings all wages..and it generally lowers overall incentive for low skilled workers.

Going from 7.95 to 15?...more like 7.95 to 10.50 or 11.50

I understand alot of people work these jobs to support their families. Minimum wage jobs ain't meant for that shit. That's like driving on I95 with a donut.

Df are you talking about. If you dont think the min wage should be raised just say it. Dont make up some nonsense hypothetical scenario, to make it seem like you're against it for the greater good.

The only main thing Wendys, Mcdonalds, BK & Chick fil a have in common is they're fast food restaurants, other than that, they dont even have the same business model. Chick Fil a is a private company and all those other places franchise. Chick Fil A maintains a high standard because one owner controls it. When you franchise the quality of the business is got to vary from franchisee to franchisee, depending on how much they care.

Raising the min wage, "lowers the incentive to do a good job". DF? How does that even make sense? lol So whats the incentive to do a good job now?

"I understand alot of people work these jobs to support their families. Minimum wage jobs ain't meant for that shit." This is amazing. The whole point of min wage was so people earn enough to live. Some of yall really believing white peoples lies that min wage jobs were made for teens in highschool. If these jobs were made for teens, then who df is working there when all these kids are in school? I dont care what you do, if you work 40 hours a week, you deserve to make a living wage. Anyone against this can suck a dick and die.

Two types of people are against a min wage increase. Company share holders that want to hoard the money, and selfish morons. They dont want the min wage to raise because it comes too close to their pay and they feel min wage workers are below them. But at no point do their dumbasses think that maybe they're being underpaid. No, it has to be the people bellow them are making too much. Holy Shit

 

[ImaInfluenza]

Df are you talking about. If you dont think the min wage should be raised just say it. Dont make up some nonsense hypothetical scenario, to make it seem like you're against it for the greater good.

The only main thing Wendys, Mcdonalds, BK & Chick fil a have in common is they're fast food restaurants, other than that, they dont even have the same business model. Chick Fil a is a private company and all those other places franchise. Chick Fil A maintains a high standard because one owner controls it. When you franchise the quality of the business is got to vary from franchisee to franchisee, depending on how much they care.

Raising the min wage, "lowers the incentive to do a good job". DF? How does that even make sense? lol So whats the incentive to do a good job now?

"I understand alot of people work these jobs to support their families. Minimum wage jobs ain't meant for that shit." This is amazing. The whole point of min wage was so people earn enough to live. Some of yall really believing white peoples lies that min wage jobs were made for teens in highschool. If these jobs were made for teens, then who df is working there when all these kids are in school? I dont care what you do, if you work 40 hours a week, you deserve to make a living wage. Anyone against this can suck a dick and die.

Two types of people are against a min wage increase. Company share holders that want to hoard the money, and selfish morons. They dont want the min wage to raise because it comes too close to their pay and they feel min wage workers are below them. But at no point do their dumbasses think that maybe they're being underpaid. No, it has to be the people bellow them are making too much. Holy Shit

Everything I said is basic economics fam, it ain't about anyone being jealous. It's about incentive. When you pay someone a certain amount..there are expectation set for the amount of pay. There are things employee are willing to put up with or buy into for that pay.

If someone is paying someone else the same amount that they are paying me. And that person doesnt have to put up with nearly half the shit I do. I'm going to go work for who they work for.

So it becomes incumbent upon who I work for to sweeten the pot to keep me as an employee, and to be desired by future employees. So they then raise their pay to take care of it.

My pay increases then the the cycle starts again with other professions looking at a job paying the same they make, and not asking for the same amount of effort and BS.

It's not about anyone being jealous, corporations understand that no one wants to do any of this shit for free. And they gotta pay, well if ima pay you, ima set expectations and some times you gonna have to eat shit for the pay.

That's from the bottom to the top..you might sit there and think CEO's, CFO's, and CTO's dont eat shit, cause the shit you eat u eat on a daily basis. Trust me, when it comes time to eat shit..they get a dump trunk full.

I've seen that shit....I've seen that shit break em...

 

[ImaInfluenza]

Heavy is the head that wears the crown isnt just some shit niggaz say in their bars

 

[B_A]

If you ran a multi-billion dollar company, no way would you be ok with being compensated the same as the workers at entry level. And there's no way to quantify what's fair to pay each tier because everyone wants more and you'll have people who demands to be compensated more than one person or will view hard work differently than the other.

Nobody needs that much an hour. The system was useful at one point but it's evident its no longer relevant and functional or conducive to a productive society as a whole. Not to say it's gonna break tomorrow but its definitely not permanent. Also, I never implied they should make same as entry level, don't infer what isn't there.

 

[Inori]

Also I can't see America getting universal income especially before getting universal Healthcare.

IF it did happened tho, cost of goods would also rise.

If the prices rise every time.. doesnt that defeat the whole point? lol

 

[Greg.nice]

Theres laws in other countries that limit how much more a ceo can make than the bottom tier worker of a company.

I think the limits are like 15 times. So a ceo can only make 15 times as much as the lowest paid worker.

This has nothing to do with how much profit the owner of a company can make. Your profits are your profits. But for the role of the ceo you can only get paid a certain amount.

As always the US is way behind on this shit.

We've been socialized and educated to find this not only natural, but progressive. Add that to an insular national culture where the general public doesn't have anything to compare it to, and here we are

BUT when the fruits of these philosophies sprout and effect too many white people, (texas) its time to investigate and possibly recalibrate/intervene. The the pendulum swings from them niggas jus need to better themselves to we need regulation at breakneck speed...

We celebrate the bullshit in one voice and groan from it in the next...all the (white) deterioration and despair around us was well earned . Now black folks aint doing ourselves no favors parroting all the jive, but hey.....

 

[Marc123]

I dont see a problem with raising the minimum but all these companies will do is cut hours. So you will be working less but bringing home the same money. So you are still going to struggle.

They will let sum ppl go.

Thats basically the argument joe machin is making.

Which is kinda true. But when poor ppl have more money, they spend it on goods n services.

So then other companies can hire them w the extra revenue

 

[Marc123]

How long can you keep minimum wage the same? Inflation averages 3% a year. Cant just have everything go up 3% every year but wages remain the same.

The idea behind a minimum wage is that it should be the least amount of money that a person can earn to survive on. And the current minimum wage isnt enough, so it needs to be increased.

There isnt any real argument against it

The argument is politicians dont care about poor ppl.

And companies donate $ to the politicians so they are paid to side w the companies/big bizness

 

[Bobjones]

Everything I said is basic economics fam, it ain't about anyone being jealous. It's about incentive. When you pay someone a certain amount..there are expectation set for the amount of pay. There are things employee are willing to put up with or buy into for that pay.

If someone is paying someone else the same amount that they are paying me. And that person doesnt have to put up with nearly half the shit I do. I'm going to go work for who they work for.

So it becomes incumbent upon who I work for to sweeten the pot to keep me as an employee, and to be desired by future employees. So they then raise their pay to take care of it.

My pay increases then the the cycle starts again with other professions looking at a job paying the same they make, and not asking for the same amount of effort and BS.

It's not about anyone being jealous, corporations understand that no one wants to do any of this shit for free. And they gotta pay, well if ima pay you, ima set expectations and some times you gonna have to eat shit for the pay.

That's from the bottom to the top..you might sit there and think CEO's, CFO's, and CTO's dont eat shit, cause the shit you eat u eat on a daily basis. Trust me, when it comes time to eat shit..they get a dump trunk full.

I've seen that shit....I've seen that shit break em...

Depends on the work.

You coulda used a better example than comparing two fast food restaurants. I've never been to chic fil a but assuming it's merely a higher grade type of fast food, most of that "higher grade" comes down to presentation and possibly higher food quality (which aren't necessarily the responsibility of minimum wagers.)

We also shouldn't get lost in this idea higher wages earners always deserve it or are receiving it purely on merit or hardwork. I was earning minimum breaking my back day in day out lifting upwards of 150lb boxes into dark, dusty and dank 50ft trailers for hours in conditions reaching 40 degrees celsius in the summer or below 0 in the winter. Meanwhile you've got some management guy typing words on a PC in a cozy office listening to soft rock radio, and he's making far more.

Just as there's a point where a lower level of pay simply isn't sustainable for living, there's a point where exorbitant levels of pay for a relative few aren't sustainable for the health and integrity of a company wide workforce.

 

[WilberDMillz]

Depends on the work.

You coulda used a better example than comparing two fast food restaurants. I've never been to chic fil a but assuming it's merely a higher grade type of fast food, most of that "higher grade" comes down to presentation and possibly higher food quality (which aren't necessarily the responsibility of minimum wagers.)

We also shouldn't get lost in this idea higher wages earners always deserve it or are receiving it purely on merit or hardwork. I was earning minimum breaking my back day in day out lifting upwards of 150lb boxes into dark, dusty and dank 50ft trailers for hours in conditions reaching 40 degrees celsius in the summer or below 0 in the winter. Meanwhile you've got some management guy typing words on a PC in a cozy office listening to soft rock radio, and he's making far more.

Just as there's a point where a lower level of pay simply isn't sustainable for living, there's a point where exorbitant levels of pay for a relative few aren't sustainable for the health and integrity of a company wide workforce.

You in Canada right? Ups was hoeing y'all. I worked there when I was in college in the early 2000's I was making $10.50 a hour....the problem was the shifts was only 4 hours. I use to pull a lot of doubles.

 

[SeaSnake]

You in Canada right? Ups was hoeing y'all. I worked there when I was in college in the early 2000's I was making $10.50 a hour....the problem was the shifts was only 4 hours. I use to pull a lot of doubles.

I know that shit was annoying like bitch give me 8 hours

 

[Mr BFK]

mofos too liberal for me on this topic

I support UBI.........but MW increases are a different story

plus cats always got smoke for CEOs........but never have the same energy for rappers/entertainers making so much money

and they stay stunting in a poor nigga's face

yet our youth stay aspiring to be like the celebs.....but we don't support them becoming Fortune 500 CEOs the same way

it's like our community embraces poverty on purpose

/end of my rant

 

[konceptjones]

Minimum wage jobs for teens?

I worked at UPS where almost every low skilled position is minimum wage and we were by and large adults.

Claiming minimum wage jobs are for teens is a convenient way to avoid the reality that adults seek these jobs in droves. Sometimes it's all that's available for people without credentials. Sometimes we've gotta work two part time jobs to make ends meet. People should be compensated adequately for it.

Then y'all were getting shafted.

Back in '98, my homie/roommate was gettin' $9.50/hr at UPS just loading the trucks. That's right around $15.50/hr in today's money. Dude kept trying to get me up in there too but I caught a temp data entry gig for the same amount of money so I was like "fuck I look like bustin' my ass when I can get the same loot to sit in an office?"