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The Lonious Monk said:
1) I didn't move the goalpost. I conceded that you were right that all of them lie. lol You're trying to criticize me for amending my statement to be more correct.
2) That image you posted doesn't say anything but "we didn't assess the entire statistical population, we assessed samples based on the data we had." In other words, they did the same thing that is done for every analysis of anything. Nobody includes everything in a population and often times things being compared don't have equal samples. lol
3) Who gives a shit how old it is? It shows that FOX has a history of being more egregious with lying. You think that's gotten better since the Trump era started? Most of the settlements and the leaks exposing that they knowingly lie have come after 2015, so if anything, it's probably worse now even if its true that all outlets have ramped up the dishonesty.

I'll never understand why some people are so willing to jump off a ledge defending right wingers when most of the time they don't even care to hide how bad they are. You can say both sides are bad without lying to yourself and saying they're the same.
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Lol u wanna ignore context all u want go for it. Your shit is 10 years old, it's a trash source in 2024.

Since 2016 corporate media credibility and ratings is at an all time low. Podcasts are more prevalent than ever as news consumption. The landscape has changed more than ever.

And your source is from 2015.
 
ChicagoFigure said:
Lol u wanna ignore context all u want go for it. Your shit is 10 years old, it's a trash source in 2024.

Since 2016 corporate media credibility and ratings is at an all time low. Podcasts are more prevalent than ever as news consumption. The landscape has changed more than ever.

And your source is from 2015.
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Who's ignoring context? Your argument is that all corporate media has become less credible. Ok, let's say that's true. The bar as a whole has dropped. What does that have to do with the gap between FoxNews and other outlets. Unless, you can point out something that has happened that suggests that the other outlets specifically have fallen, then it's not really relevant. It's just like when the economy crashes. Everybody's money goes down, but the rich still have more money that the poor. lol

Have it your way though, I'll see if I can find a more recent source.
 
The Lonious Monk said:
Who's ignoring context? Your argument is that all corporate media has become less credible. Ok, let's say that's true. The bar as a whole has dropped. What does that have to do with the gap between FoxNews and other outlets. Unless, you can point out something that has happened that suggests that the other outlets specifically have fallen, then it's not really relevant. It's just like when the economy crashes. Everybody's money goes down, but the rich still have more money that the poor. lol

Have it your way though, I'll see if I can find a more recent source.
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Lol at have it my way. U responded to my post where I was keeping the last 8 years in mind, which is drastically different than before Trump got into office. That is the context your article doesn't grasp.

Everyone knows FoxNews isn't shit and hasn't been shit for as long as I can remember. What some don't seem to accept (not saying u) is not only did the bar drop, but other outlets have stooped to their level in many cases.
 
ChicagoFigure said:
Lol at have it my way. U responded to my post where I was keeping the last 8 years in mind, which is drastically different than before Trump got into office. That is the context your article doesn't grasp.

Everyone knows FoxNews isn't shit and hasn't been shit for as long as I can remember. What some don't seem to accept (not saying u) is not only did the bar drop, but other outlets have stooped to their level in many cases.
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Unfortunately, Punditfact doesn't seem to do the network fact checks anymore. You can look at the individual host each website and see that the ones on FOX clearly lie more than other hosts, but that's probably not good enough for you.

I don't think many people would argue that the left leaning corporate media is terrible either. After all, they got caught helping to rig the primary for Hillary. That's actually worst than them just lying. Still there is a difference. There's actually a paper from 2022 for an experiment where they got around 100 FOXNews viewers to switch over to CNN for a period of time. They found that doing that didn't change their viewpoint. They were still right leaning, but even the viewers admitted that they felt more informed about what actually mattered than when they watched FOX. That's not the same thing as saying FOX lies more, but it shows that there is a real difference between how they handle the news and how other do, and it's not just a matter of bias.

OSF

osf.io
 
The Lonious Monk said:
Unfortunately, Punditfact doesn't seem to do the network fact checks anymore. You can look at the individual host each website and see that the ones on FOX clearly lie more than other hosts, but that's probably not good enough for you.

I don't think many people would argue that the left leaning corporate media is terrible either. After all, they got caught helping to rig the primary for Hillary. That's actually worst than them just lying. Still there is a difference. There's actually a paper from 2022 for an experiment where they got around 100 FOXNews viewers to switch over to CNN for a period of time. They found that doing that didn't change their viewpoint. They were still right leaning, but even the viewers admitted that they felt more informed about what actually mattered than when they watched FOX. That's not the same thing as saying FOX lies more, but it shows that there is a real difference between how they handle the news and how other do, and it's not just a matter of bias.

OSF

osf.io
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It seems in my opinion you've shifted closer to my stance than I to yours. There are many other examples besides a network helping to rig a primary for a candidate, tho probably not as serious as that. Bc if they are willing to do that, there's more where it came from.

But u have to consider that ppls bias makes it harder to notice the bullshit from the outlets they subscribe to. Foxnews stands out the most (in part) bc, as far as mainstream networks, it's the only one that leans (hard) to the right.
 
ChicagoFigure said:
It seems in my opinion you've shifted closer to my stance than I to yours. There are many other examples besides a network helping to rig a primary for a candidate, tho probably not as serious as that. Bc if they are willing to do that, there's more where it came from.

But u have to consider that ppls bias makes it harder to notice the bullshit from the outlets they subscribe to. Foxnews stands out the most (in part) bc, as far as mainstream networks, it's the only one that leans (hard) to the right.
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No, the bold is what the paper refuted. That was basically the authors' hypothesis that the FOX viewers would watch CNN and rail at what they perceived to be BS. That's not what happened though. They, by their own admission, came away feeling like they were more informed after watching CNN even thought they agreed with the politics of FOX.

You and I are still pretty far from each other. You essentially think they are all the same. I'm saying that MSNBC and CNN might be bad news networks, but they are still news. FOX isn't even news. It's almost completely propaganda and lies. When Tucker Carlson got taken to court for defamation and slander, his defense was basically "Tucker just talks and no reasonable person should take what he says seriously."
 
The Lonious Monk said:
No, the bold is what the paper refuted. That was basically the authors' hypothesis that the FOX viewers would watch CNN and rail at what they perceived to be BS. That's not what happened though. They, by their own admission, came away feeling like they were more informed after watching CNN even thought they agreed with the politics of FOX.

You and I are still pretty far from each other. You essentially think they are all the same. I'm saying that MSNBC and CNN might be bad news networks, but they are still news. FOX isn't even news. It's almost completely propaganda and lies. When Tucker Carlson got taken to court for defamation and slander, his defense was basically "Tucker just talks and no reasonable person should take what he says seriously."
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If intelligence agencies collude with mainstream outlets and social media platforms to censor that is by definition propaganda, especially when the narrative that is being pushed turns out to be false or misleading.

Also if you can admit that an outlet essentially attempted to subvert democracy by trying to rig a primary, and can admit that is actually worse than lying, you also admit it's an example that is worse than your Tucker's defamation suit example.

Which is why I said "worse is a matter of opinion". Both are bad in their own ways. I'm not saying the way they lie is exactly the same, but they're all full of shit.
 
ChicagoFigure said:
If intelligence agencies collude with mainstream outlets and social media platforms to censor that is by definition propaganda, especially when the narrative that is being pushed turns out to be false or misleading.

Also if you can admit that an outlet essentially attempted to subvert democracy by trying to rig a primary, and can admit that is actually worse than lying, you also admit it's an example that is worse than your Tucker's defamation suit example.

Which is why I said "worse is a matter of opinion". Both are bad in their own ways. I'm not saying the way they lie is exactly the same, but they're all full of shit.
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lol But they both tried to subvert democracy. FOXNews was sued for knowingly spreading false information with the voting scandal in an attempt to undermine election integrity.

At the end of the day, you're right, all these organizations have isolated examples of egregious wrongdoing and lying. However, FOX is the one out of the bunch where that type of operation is the status quo.
 
The Lonious Monk said:
lol But they both tried to subvert democracy. FOXNews was sued for knowingly spreading false information with the voting scandal in an attempt to undermine election integrity.

At the end of the day, you're right, all these organizations have isolated examples of egregious wrongdoing and lying. However, FOX is the one out of the bunch where that type of operation is the status quo.
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Bruh your first sentence doesn't attack my stance it supports it. I'm not downplaying FoxNews I'm saying y'all are downplaying the other outlets. Foxnews falsely reported while the other actively participated. Do the math.

Other outlets have gotten marching orders from the government. That's ultimate propaganda.

Whether u wanna argue which is worse to what degree is not the argument I was making. U to a degree agreed with my initial point some posts ago.
 
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