OPINION Contradictions and Lies! Exposing the Democratic Party

[Knock_Twice]

Main issue I take with your argument is the "3rd grade level" shit is ignoring a lot of other things that actually is her and the Dem parties fault.

Right, and that's where we disconnected.

I tried explaining to him that some of what was said may be true, but you can't say 3rd grade level people caused her to lose. My grandfather had a 3rd grade education and was a wise man. One of the smartest men that I've ever met.

You can't put your feelings into play, logic is at play. Those people voted for who they wanted to vote for.

1st it was eggs...then I said, ok, why Kamala didn't speak on lowering eggs, crickets.

 

[Knock_Twice]

I agree with you which I feel like I've been trying to communicate to knock

They weren't voting for her anyway despite her policies

I stated that her policies fit your criteria or needs, her policies didn't not fit everyone's else. Is that a fair statement to say?

I don't need 20k brotha, I used that example because you brought it up. You said people need houses, You are speaking for me and the people you call idoits. I don't need a house nor anyone that I know needs a house. I don't know any 1st time buyers brotha. I'm past that stage in my life and as I said that 20k comes with red-tape, you have to qualify to get it and in most cases, there's things put into place to stop black folks from getting funding. I know this game too well. That also was a reason why I wasn't a fan of this 20k incentive. I know how lenders and under-writers can be.

That person who child/husband or wife may not need a house, they need something on the books for immigration, the housing item is not their concern....so that item, is not relevant to them. So now they're down to 9 items to choose from... using the 10 item example.

If they don't see immigration etc etc on the list that will help them, chances are they won't vote for the candidate. That's what I am trying to convey to you.


Kamala polices, some of not all were not important to some voters. If they were, they would have voted for her, folks wouldn't have sat on the couch, flipped or voted for another person.

 

[AP4.0]

Main issue I take with your argument is the "3rd grade level" shit is ignoring a lot of other things that actually is her and the Dem parties fault.

You can take issue with it and I still contend she could've done a flawless execution and people that weren't going to vote for her cause she was a woman, still weren't going to vote for her

The ones that weren't going to vote for her cause she's black, still weren't going to vote for her

The ones that weren't going to vote for her cause they didn't know the affordable care act was the same as Obamacare weren't going to vote for her

You should also be taking issue with the fact that the other side played on the ignorance and sheer stupidity of half the country

 

[AP4.0]

I stated that her policies fit your criteria or needs, her policies didn't not fit everyone's else. Is that a fair statement to say?

I don't need 20k brotha, I used that example because you brought it up. You said people need houses, You are speaking for me and the people you call idoits. I don't need a house nor anyone that I know needs a house. I don't know any 1st time buyers brotha. I'm past that stage in my life and as I said that 20k comes with red-tape, you have to qualify to get it and in most cases, there's things put into place to stop black folks from getting funding. I know this game too well. That also was a reason why I wasn't a fan of this 20k incentive. I know how lenders and under-writers can be.

That person who child/husband or wife may not need a house, they need something on the books for immigration, the housing item is not their concern....so that item, is not relevant to them. So now they're down to 9 items to choose from... using the 10 item example.

If they don't see immigration etc etc on the list that will help them, chances are they won't vote for the candidate. That's what I am trying to convey to you.


Kamala polices, some of not all were not important to some voters. If they were, they would have voted for her, folks wouldn't have sat on the couch, flipped or voted for another person.

So cause you don't need it, fuck if other people need it

Got it

 

[Knock_Twice]

So cause you don't need it, fuck if other people need it

Got it

You make it seem like it's a bad thing. Put it like this, I'm not here to save the world, I'm here to save my family and get these people who want my vote to give me what's important to me and my family, not to those people you call idiots or anybody else because I know they feel the same way.

They are here to advance their families, put them in the best outcome that they can possibly be in, or address their own personal needs/concerns. I need to do the same

I don't know what else to tell you brotha, but politics has always been about self/family/group.

Do you think a maga person wants to see me advance or a police officer who just pulled my cousin over for nothing or harassed some black kids at the park but on his personal vehicle has a Kamala bumper sticker on his rear end wants my family, friends, cousins to eat? lol.

No.

You think the Somalis wanted to share their resources? No lol. Man people are single-issue voters and vote for their own interest. Not everybody's else.

Somalis apparently didn't need that 20k and house.

 

[Knock_Twice]

You can take issue with it and I still contend she could've done a flawless execution and people that weren't going to vote for her cause she was a woman, still weren't going to vote for her

The ones that weren't going to vote for her cause she's black, still weren't going to vote for her

The ones that weren't going to vote for her cause they didn't know the affordable care act was the same as Obamacare weren't going to vote for her

You should also be taking issue with the fact that the other side played on the ignorance and sheer stupidity of half the country

I have to push back, people voted for Hilary Clinton. I can't let you do that brotha. Now you what you said about racism is true, and what you've said here is true as well, but to say that 'everybody' took this approach is not true. That's where I have to push back on.

The logic of it all is that Kamala did not win over voters with her policies too. That can be thrown into the bucket as well.

 

[BlackRain]

I think you challenged dead-eye's response to single-issue voters. AP had an issue with it, and Night said something along the lines as being crazy.

You 3 are not in favor for single voter issues. I am not re-writing anything, the last 3 pages were me "pro" and explaining to you 3 that single voter issues has always been the standard in this country and in other countries.

If you're criticizng their method, then you are not a fan of single voter issues Lol. Brotha do you hear yourself double talking. That's not me re-writing anything.

I'm not trying to insult you, but you 3 are not fans of what most people do in this country and that's ok. I and Deadeye in this convo on this topic were simply saying voters don't think like you 3 think.

I provided many examples. An immigration law may hit closer to home to one vs another one. Their concern about other stuff takes the backseat. This is what you 3 fail to understand. Everybody's picks are not the same, people have different picks for their own reasons, not for the greater of anybody else.

All you all are saying is based on feelings. A person having their child not deported is not shorting themselves? lol the fuck.

That person wants their child and by them focusing on immigration laws etc, they have that right, they don't give a shit about what else is on the table, they want their child to not be deport or whatever. That's fair

That's how voters have always voted brotha and will always vote.

I never said I was a fan of their method. From jump I've said it doesn't make sense. So there is no double talking. I acknowledge they exist i also think their method is ineffective. There's no double talking there at all. Acknowledgement doesn't equate to agreement.

You seem to have an issue with realizing that there will always be an intersection of issues. You mentioned immigration. You think housing and the economy doesn't affect immigration? What was it that the right used to convince people that immigrants were ruining the country? A lack of housing and jobs they tricked people into thinking was being stolen by immigrants. Which has led to the bullshit we see with ice. Also as i mentioned affecting businesses that depend on immigrant labor. You can find story after story right now of people who voted for Trump because of his stance on immigration who are now upset that those same stances have now hurt their bottom line. But because they didn't consider any other issues they didn't see how supporting one affects another.

So yeah immigration policy may be somebody #1 issue but they would.be foolish to also ignore economy, employment and housing issues too. Because they all effect one another.

 

[ChicagoFigure]

You can take issue with it and I still contend she could've done a flawless execution and people that weren't going to vote for her cause she was a woman, still weren't going to vote for her

The ones that weren't going to vote for her cause she's black, still weren't going to vote for her

The ones that weren't going to vote for her cause they didn't know the affordable care act was the same as Obamacare weren't going to vote for her

You should also be taking issue with the fact that the other side played on the ignorance and sheer stupidity of half the country

There is always going to be that segment of the population that votes that way but it still never stopped democrats from winning, white or black.

There are always going to be a segment of ignorant voters on both sides.

The problem is its not just that the execution wasn't flawless, it was horrible. At the beginning of the campaign in the presidential thread I remember pointing out their strategy was to let her talk as little as possible and let trump flail. It was working up until ppl started asking for policies. They sucked at getting the policies out and on top of that once she started making appearances she was making misstep after misstep.

She couldn't even explain the mechanics of her plan to bring inflation down. She gave a lot of non answers, add to the debacle of Biden's cognitive decline.

U have to ignore A LOT of shit to boil it down to ignorant voters, who have always existed.

 

[Knock_Twice]

I never said I was a fan of their method. From jump I've said it doesn't make sense. So there is no double talking. I acknowledge they exist i also think their method is ineffective. There's no double talking there at all. Acknowledgement doesn't equate to agreement.

You seem to have an issue with realizing that there will always be an intersection of issues. You mentioned immigration. You think housing and the economy doesn't affect immigration? What was it that the right used to convince people that immigrants were ruining the country? A lack of housing and jobs they tricked people into thinking was being stolen by immigrants. Which has led to the bullshit we see with ice. Also as i mentioned affecting businesses that depend on immigrant labor. You can find story after story right now of people who voted for Trump because of his stance on immigration who are now upset that those same stances have now hurt their bottom line. But because they didn't consider any other issues they didn't see how supporting one affects another.

So yeah immigration policy may be somebody #1 issue but they would.be foolish to also ignore economy, employment and housing issues too. Because they all effect one another.

Brotha the method doesn't make sense to you, but it makes sense to the people that have been using this method way before we've been born. Ending slavery, you think black folks wanted to hear about any other issues other than slavery at the time? Civil Rights Act passing, you think other issues were important than this single issue at the time?

It's not that I don't understand what seem to cross, I stated this, I used an example of
gas price rising and a woman having to worry about her child being deported. I stated that a woman may not be concerned about gas prices rising because she is concerned about her child, husband, sister, etc being deported.
The gas prices takes the backseat for her when she's tryin to decide who to vote for. She is focus on immigration, not other things such as housing.


Why is that foolish?

You can say this though because none of this is at your front door, I'm sure if you had a child that was on the brinks of being deported, I don't think you'll be too worried about the price of eggs or gas? Now Would you?

Would you be concerned about the candidates always taking time to address the price of eggs, gas and wars? or would you want them to be addressing immigrations?
Which one?


Let your child, or children get taken by ICE? Would want them the candidates to do something right? or would you be concerned about eggs?

I'm not understanding how a mother is foolish for thinking this way

 

[Knock_Twice]

There is always going to be that segment of the population that votes that way but it still never stopped democrats from winning, white or black.

There are always going to be a segment of ignorant voters on both sides.

The problem is its not just that the execution wasn't flawless, it was horrible. At the beginning of the campaign in the presidential thread I remember pointing out their strategy was to let her talk as little as possible and let trump flail. It was working up until ppl started asking for policies. They sucked at getting the policies out and on top of that once she started making appearances she was making misstep after misstep.

She couldn't even explain the mechanics of her plan to bring inflation down. She gave a lot of non answers, add to the debacle of Biden's cognitive decline.

U have to ignore A LOT of shit to boil it down to ignorant voters, who have always existed.

She did a 60 minute interview and crashed out. She was stuck and folks that were on the couch watching her be questioned and having to give answers, she was not the best at convincing people to vote for her.

 

[Knock_Twice]

I never said I was a fan of their method. From jump I've said it doesn't make sense. So there is no double talking. I acknowledge they exist i also think their method is ineffective. There's no double talking there at all. Acknowledgement doesn't equate to agreement.

You seem to have an issue with realizing that there will always be an intersection of issues. You mentioned immigration. You think housing and the economy doesn't affect immigration? What was it that the right used to convince people that immigrants were ruining the country? A lack of housing and jobs they tricked people into thinking was being stolen by immigrants. Which has led to the bullshit we see with ice. Also as i mentioned affecting businesses that depend on immigrant labor. You can find story after story right now of people who voted for Trump because of his stance on immigration who are now upset that those same stances have now hurt their bottom line. But because they didn't consider any other issues they didn't see how supporting one affects another.

So yeah immigration policy may be somebody #1 issue but they would.be foolish to also ignore economy, employment and housing issues too. Because they all effect one another.

Brotha,

When folks are focusing on what they want and need, nothing matters at that time. I'm not sure on why you don't understand this. Folks not concerned about the next person or how things will look a year down the road, they are more concerned about what happens with my vote and what I want to get for my vote that's going to help me and my family out in the moment.

This is what I need or want, and is this person going to get this need of mines that I want.

That is how things transpire in this country. This is how things will be moving forward.

Folks have seen how bad things can get, and they are under the impression, "well it's already bad, let me just get what's important to me" That's how life/voting will become moving forward

Which means the scare tactics won't work because as I said, shit is already bad, been bad for the past 8 or so years, folks have seen enough, so they are on some, I'm living in hell, let me just go for mines as Kamala stated, "Get Yours

That we don't need a baby Trump, that won't work, because folks have seen Trump Trump and lived under Biden....Both Presidents were awful.

Now folks are on some...let me just get what we need, which is why black folks are on a different wavelength to me. Some

 

[BlackRain]

Brotha the method doesn't make sense to you, but it makes sense to the people that have been using this method way before we've been born. Ending slavery, you think black folks wanted to hear about any other issues other than slavery at the time? Civil Rights Act passing, you think other issues were important than this single issue at the time?

It's not that I don't understand what seem to cross, I stated this, I used an example of
gas price rising and a woman having to worry about her child being deported. I stated that a woman may not be concerned about gas prices rising because she is concerned about her child, husband, sister, etc being deported.
The gas prices takes the backseat for her when she's tryin to decide who to vote for. She is focus on immigration, not other things such as housing.


Why is that foolish?

You can say this though because none of this is at your front door, I'm sure if you had a child that was on the brinks of being deported, I don't think you'll be too worried about the price of eggs or gas? Now Would you?

Would you be concerned about the candidates always taking time to address the price of eggs, gas and wars? or would you want them to be addressing immigrations?
Which one?


Let your child, or children get taken by ICE? Would want them the candidates to do something right? or would you be concerned about eggs?

I'm not understanding how a mother is foolish for thinking this way

For one...I said the idea is foolish not the person. That's a big difference. You're trying to personalize it into an insult that I'm not saying. I also never said it would be foolish to have an issue you prioritizing over other issues. But you can't ignore how other things are going to affect whatever main issue you are worried about. So yeah that mother can be concerned about immigration as the top thing. But if it comes down to voting, there's multiple issues that affect immigration that would also need to be considered. And that has already been broken down to you multiple times how they intersect.

 

[BlackRain]

There is always going to be that segment of the population that votes that way but it still never stopped democrats from winning, white or black.

There are always going to be a segment of ignorant voters on both sides.

The problem is its not just that the execution wasn't flawless, it was horrible. At the beginning of the campaign in the presidential thread I remember pointing out their strategy was to let her talk as little as possible and let trump flail. It was working up until ppl started asking for policies. They sucked at getting the policies out and on top of that once she started making appearances she was making misstep after misstep.

She couldn't even explain the mechanics of her plan to bring inflation down. She gave a lot of non answers, add to the debacle of Biden's cognitive decline.

U have to ignore A LOT of shit to boil it down to ignorant voters, who have always existed.

The bold is historically inaccurate based on the history of racism alone in this country. I agree and said a while back Kamala could have run a better campaign..but it's flat out fact that being Black on its own turns some voters away.

 

[ChicagoFigure]

She did a 60 minute interview and crashed out. She was stuck and folks that were on the couch watching her be questioned and having to give answers, she was not the best at convincing people to vote for her.

Not only that but it gave off an impression that she was just being pushed to the presidential seat by the same ppl who finally caved and pushed Biden out. The whole thing seemed very inauthentic and made it easier for trump to win with his fake populist rhetoric....which by the way, the Dems seem to finally catch on to after totally forgetting about it for years.

 

[BlackRain]

Brotha,

When folks are focusing on what they want and need, nothing matters at that time. I'm not sure on why you don't understand this. Folks not concerned about the next person or how things will look a year down the road, they are more concerned about what happens with my vote and what I want to get for my vote that's going to help me and my family out in the moment.

This is what I need or want, and is this person going to get this need of mines that I want.

That is how things transpire in this country. This is how things will be moving forward.

Folks have seen how bad things can get, and they are under the impression, "well it's already bad, let me just get what's important to me" That's how life/voting will become moving forward

Which means the scare tactics won't work because as I said, shit is already bad, been bad for the past 8 or so years, folks have seen enough, so they are on some, I'm living in hell, let me just go for mines as Kamala stated, "Get Yours

That we don't need a baby Trump, that won't work, because folks have seen Trump Trump and lived under Biden....Both Presidents were awful.

Now folks are on some...let me just get what we need, which is why black folks are on a different wavelength to me. Some

You can focus on what you need and want and be as selfish as you want. Being a single issue voter would actually contradict that mentality because by definition that voter is shorting themselves by focusing only on 1 issue. And again...why advocate for a method that will leave you shorthanded?

 

[ChicagoFigure]

The bold is historically inaccurate based on the history of racism alone in this country. I agree and said a while back Kamala could have run a better campaign..but it's flat out fact that being Black on its own turns some voters away.

I'm not disagreeing with that but when Obama won it was historically the most amount of votes a candidate ever got. He won decisively, which means, while its still a factor, it can't be played as the main one, especially when Kamala was already an unpopular candidate the first time she ran, running again off the back of an already unpopular administration and vowing to not change anything.

 

[Knock_Twice]

For one...I said the idea is foolish not the person. That's a big difference. You're trying to personalize it into an insult that I'm not saying. I also never said it would be foolish to have an issue you prioritizing over other issues. But you can't ignore how other things are going to affect whatever main issue you are worried about. So yeah that mother can be concerned about immigration as the top thing. But if it comes down to voting, there's multiple issues that affect immigration that would also need to be considered. And that has already been broken down to you multiple times how they intersect.

Just because you've broken down the things multiple times does not mean what I'm saying is incorrect.

Single issue voters only are concerned about their issue. You get that. I know you get that. Anything else that you would like to add on becomes a you problem in a sense.

I don't have an issue with a person only choosing to vote for their most important request. You, AP, and Knight have an issue.

Whether you wanna mentioned other things that may affect this mother in this example, what I'm telling you, it doesn't matter to her. She don't wanna consider the things that you want her to consider in real time brotha.

That's how people move, people don't vote your way, connecting several dots going down the rabbit hole. People may not be invested to that point

You, AP, and Knight criticize these people, call them idiots, now you want these people to connect 5 to 20 dots? You can't have it both ways brotha,

Either they're dumb, stupid or they're smart like you that can analyze things to the point of making a calculated vote based off of many variables.

 

[Knock_Twice]

You can focus on what you need and want and be as selfish as you want. Being a single issue voter would actually contradict that mentality because by definition that voter is shorting themselves by focusing only on 1 issue. And again...why advocate for a method that will leave you shorthanded?

Brotha, using this example, if reparations was all that I wanted and let's just say, I voted for this candidate they wins, and black folks are awarded 15k, I'll use a low number.

Most of those black folks don't care about anything else, they got what they wanted, the other stuff is extra on top, some may not even know what the secondary things are, they are focus on getting that reparations.

Why is this so hard for you to understand, and be content with? You keep adding on things that nobody's concerned about. At the time they not worried about what's not helping them that you may deem to be helpful, the most important thing that they want is the reparations in this example.

 

[Knock_Twice]

The bold is historically inaccurate based on the history of racism alone in this country. I agree and said a while back Kamala could have run a better campaign..but it's flat out fact that being Black on its own turns some voters away.

I have to push back again, because Obama was black and he won

 

[BlackRain]

I'm not disagreeing with that but when Obama won it was historically the most amount of votes a candidate ever got. He won decisively, which means, while its still a factor, it can't be played as the main one, especially when Kamala was already an unpopular candidate the first time she ran, running again off the back of an already unpopular administration and vowing to not change anything.

Sorry but I can't ever downplay racism and how much it may affect somethings. Shit even with Obama there were literally hanging dolls of him after he got elected. Anytime he weighed in on a race issue the right pounced and tried to spin the reverse racism card. The birther stuff. All racism. The racist reaction post Obama is a huge reason we at where we are today.