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White Woman Caught Trying To Pass As Black

Am I supposed to name 5 people you know...or...what? My dad is only about 30% white and he didn't even know he was mostly black until 2 years ago. Genetics aren't as simple as some of you try to make it.

And you're saying my argument doesn't make sense, but you don't even seem to understand what my argument is. Again, there are people who you would consider mixed that are darker than people who you wouldn't consider mixed, so your tie between being mixed and being light doesn't work. That's not my argument, that's a fact. It can't be argued. And you keep saying that black folks face obstacles that mixed people don't. Name one. Harassment by cops? Mixed people get that too. Job denial? Mixed people get that too. General racism? Mixed people get that too. The flaw with your argument that you don't seem to understand is that in a lot of the statistics that define black oppression, many of the respondents are mixed, because in America, mixed people have traditionally been considered black. On top of that, a lot of mixed people aren't really distinguishable from "blacks" by your definition. So tell me, if the people that discriminate against blacks, can't even tell a mixed person from a black person or don't really care even if they could, why would they treat mixed people differently?


You named one guy. 30+ million black folks in the U.S., I'm sure you can name more than one man

In a colortocracy darker skin people are typically subject to more prejudice. I'm not saying they face unique challenges (although racial ambiguity fetishism seems to be thing) but that the amount and degree of prejudice mixed people experience is less severe. This view coincides with the limited research that has been done on income and employment among mixed citizens compared to people who are fully black or white
 
You named one guy. 30+ million black folks in the U.S., I'm sure you can name more than one man

In a colortocracy darker skin people are typically subject to more prejudice. I'm not saying they face unique challenges (although racial ambiguity fetishism seems to be thing) but that the amount and degree of prejudice mixed people experience is less severe. This view coincides with the limited research that has been done on income and employment among mixed citizens compared to people who are fully black or white

I can name plenty, but you don't know them. We don't know each other, so the only people I could mention that you'd know would be famous people. That makes your request a test of my knowledge of famous people and isn't relevant to the discussion.

There's no point in discussing this with you any further. You keep on making posts that basically just say lighter people get treated better than darker people. I'm not arguing against that. I agree with that and I've said that multiple times. Until you can address the actual point I'm making, this is done.
 
I can name plenty, but you don't know them. We don't know each other, so the only people I could mention that you'd know would be famous people. That makes your request a test of my knowledge of famous people and isn't relevant to the discussion.

There's no point in discussing this with you any further. You keep on making posts that basically just say lighter people get treated better than darker people. I'm not arguing against that. I agree with that and I've said that multiple times. Until you can address the actual point I'm making, this is done.

It's not a test of celebrity knowledge. Any schmuck can say "well x amount of people want y", but it is more convincing when someone can actually attest to knowing those people. I don't know your dad and you mentioned him, so I don't understand why you're playing that card now

You asked me to post up some support for the view that the amount of racial prejudice one experiences is proportional to their melanin. I posted what I could find, as far as income is concerned, and shared some of Du Bois quotes. What else do you think is unconvincing about that view?
 
It's not a test of celebrity knowledge. Any schmuck can say "well x amount of people want y", but it is more convincing when someone can actually attest to knowing those people. I don't know your dad and you mentioned him, so I don't understand why you're playing that card now

You asked me to post up some support for the view that the amount of racial prejudice one experiences is proportional to their melanin. I posted what I could find, as far as income is concerned, and shared some of Du Bois quotes. What else do you think is unconvincing about that view?

Dude, you ask me to name 5 people who weren't mixed at the parent level. I can name 10 easy from people I know including my father. But you don't know those people, so again, your question isn't a test of the veracity of my statement. It's a test of my ability to name famous people because those are the only people that we have a chance of both knowing.

And no, I'm not really sure why this is so hard for you to understand, but I never asked you to prove anything about colorism. I've agreed with you from the start that colorism is a thing. What I told you to provide is proof that the average mixed person faces less of a struggle than the average nonmixed black person. That DuBois quote doesn't even pertain to that question. The income data shows that having a white parent could may mean that a person will start at a higher level. However, it doesn't show that a mixed person will face less adversity just because that person is mixed.
 
Dude, you ask me to name 5 people who weren't mixed at the parent level. I can name 10 easy from people I know including my father. But you don't know those people, so again, your question isn't a test of the veracity of my statement. It's a test of my ability to name famous people because those are the only people that we have a chance of both knowing.

And no, I'm not really sure why this is so hard for you to understand, but I never asked you to prove anything about colorism. I've agreed with you from the start that colorism is a thing. What I told you to provide is proof that the average mixed person faces less of a struggle than the average nonmixed black person. That DuBois quote doesn't even pertain to that question. The income data shows that having a white parent could may mean that a person will start at a higher level. However, it doesn't show that a mixed person will face less adversity just because that person is mixed.


Your view doesn't fit the data or research:

Self Esteem:
Colorism can affect how you see and feel about yourself, how you treat yourself, and your actual behaviors in various situations. Skin color is associated with self-esteem for some Black women where having a darker skin tone is associated with lower self-worth (Thompson, 2001). Sadly, this occurs in both adults and youth. A study that examined skin color in the lives of 123 African American adolescents (aged 11–19 years) found complexion to be related to self-esteem, but the study also brought additional complexity to the issue. Students who selfreported as “lighter” or “darker” had lower levels of satisfaction with their skin color than did students whose skin color was classified as “somewhere in between” (Robinson, & Ward, 1995).

Perceptions of Beauty: Skin tone can affect how we are judged by other Black people. This has been found for example in attractiveness ratings assigned to Black women (Hill, 2002). Because appearance is often central in the evaluation of women, the effect of colorism on self-esteem and well-being is stronger for African American girls and women compared to males (Thompson & Keith, 2001). Adolescent girls and women are at greater risk of self-objectification reinforced through constant societal messages and media images emphasizing the physical appearance of women and girls. For African American girls, self-objectification may appear as a preference for physical characteristics they believe will be judged more favorably (i.e., lighter skin, longer hair, keen features, fine hair texture, etc.). This may pose a particular risk for African American girls who may not conform to this standard. Wingood et al. (2002) for example, found that African American girls, who judged their physical appearance negatively, felt they had less personal control over condom use and choice of sexual partners. African American girls who adopt standards consistent with “colorism” may judge their physical appearance too harshly and may adopt risky behaviors to be seen as sexually attractive/desirable (Townsend et al., 2010).

Economic Opportunity: Skin color affects education and income for African American women. Skin color has also been found to be related to the education level of an African American woman’s spouse. Lighter-skinned women are not more likely to be married than their darker-skinned counterparts, but are likely to marry higher status spouses (Hunter 1998; Udry et al. 1971). Lighter-skinned job applicants tend to benefit from the halo effect of physical attractiveness (Etcoff, 2000); attractive people are viewed as smarter and friendlier (Mulford, 1998). Skin color discrimination affects who gets the job, pay, and success on the job (Keith and Herring, 1991; Hunter, 2002).

Risk Behaviors: Internalizing colorism attitudes can contribute to higher sexual risk and substance use behavior, by African American girls (Lowman-Jackson, 2013; Townsend et al., 2010; Wallace et al., 2011). For example, Wallace, Townsend, Glasgow, & Ojie’s (2011) study of 272 African American adolescent girls found that girls who endorsed a standard of beauty consistent with colorism reported higher levels of substance use (Wallace, et al., 2011). Skin bleaching is another important risk behavior. Throughout the Caribbean, Africa, and in the United States, skin bleaching has several serious and negative health effects including mercury poisoning, permanent thinning of the skin, premature aging of the skin, increased risk of skin cancer, and skin infections. While skin bleaching fell out of favor in the US after the Civil rights movement, in many other parts of the world skin (including Africa, the Caribbean, Central and South America, Asia, and India) bleaching is reaching new heights (Hunter, 2007).

General Bias: Colorism is fairly pervasive among Black people world-wide and among other ethno-cultural groups (e.g., Mexican, Filipino, Vietnamese, Saudi, Brazilian, Japanese, and Indian people to name a few). Forty-eight percent of African Americans completing an on-line survey showed an anti-Black bias (Nosek, Greenwald & Banaji, as cited by Tummala-Narra, 2007). Further, the issue of colorism cuts both ways with negative consequences for both light and darker skinned Black people. The ethnic legitimacy or authenticity of lighter skinned Blacks is sometimes questioned or challenged while those with darker-skin tones are seen as more ethnically authentic (Hunter, 2007). Continual exposure to stereotypes can result in self-stereotyping (Sinclair, Hardin and Lowery, 2006). Essentially a person begins to behave in ways consistent with various stereotypes. Since the identity of African American girls may be influenced by the volume of negative media depictions of African American women, their identity may include remnants of negative stereotypes which can devalue their sense of their beauty and damage their selfesteem (Stephens & Phillips, 2003). The Diaspora: People of African ancestry in the US, the Caribbean, Central and South America, Africa, and other parts of the globe continue to suffer from internalized colonialism/racism, which may affect relational decisions such as: mate selection, notions of inferiority, perceptions of beauty, and social class distinctions (Gaines & Ramkissoon, 2008). This is not just a US phenomenon. For example, the Jamaican population is over 90% persons of African ancestry, yet continued privileging of lighter skin color is common. It is not uncommon for Caribbean children to be socialized that White and lighter skinned playmates are preferable (Fanon, 1967). Implicit and explicit messages are provided that Whiter features are preferred in mate selection (Gaines & Ramkissoon, 2008). These messages are consistent with the booming market and availability of skin bleaching products in Africa and throughout the Caribbean (Christopher, 2003; Also see The Jamaican healthy campaign: “Don’t Kill the Skin”). According to the World Health Organization (WHO), Nigeria has the world’s highest percentage of women (77%) using skin-lightening products. In Togo the estimates hover around 59%. Colorism exists within communities of African ancestry across the world.


Source: https://static.oprah.com/pdf/dark-girls.pdf
 
Your view doesn't fit the data or research:

Self Esteem:
Colorism can affect how you see and feel about yourself, how you treat yourself, and your actual behaviors in various situations. Skin color is associated with self-esteem for some Black women where having a darker skin tone is associated with lower self-worth (Thompson, 2001). Sadly, this occurs in both adults and youth. A study that examined skin color in the lives of 123 African American adolescents (aged 11–19 years) found complexion to be related to self-esteem, but the study also brought additional complexity to the issue. Students who selfreported as “lighter” or “darker” had lower levels of satisfaction with their skin color than did students whose skin color was classified as “somewhere in between” (Robinson, & Ward, 1995).

Perceptions of Beauty: Skin tone can affect how we are judged by other Black people. This has been found for example in attractiveness ratings assigned to Black women (Hill, 2002). Because appearance is often central in the evaluation of women, the effect of colorism on self-esteem and well-being is stronger for African American girls and women compared to males (Thompson & Keith, 2001). Adolescent girls and women are at greater risk of self-objectification reinforced through constant societal messages and media images emphasizing the physical appearance of women and girls. For African American girls, self-objectification may appear as a preference for physical characteristics they believe will be judged more favorably (i.e., lighter skin, longer hair, keen features, fine hair texture, etc.). This may pose a particular risk for African American girls who may not conform to this standard. Wingood et al. (2002) for example, found that African American girls, who judged their physical appearance negatively, felt they had less personal control over condom use and choice of sexual partners. African American girls who adopt standards consistent with “colorism” may judge their physical appearance too harshly and may adopt risky behaviors to be seen as sexually attractive/desirable (Townsend et al., 2010).

Economic Opportunity: Skin color affects education and income for African American women. Skin color has also been found to be related to the education level of an African American woman’s spouse. Lighter-skinned women are not more likely to be married than their darker-skinned counterparts, but are likely to marry higher status spouses (Hunter 1998; Udry et al. 1971). Lighter-skinned job applicants tend to benefit from the halo effect of physical attractiveness (Etcoff, 2000); attractive people are viewed as smarter and friendlier (Mulford, 1998). Skin color discrimination affects who gets the job, pay, and success on the job (Keith and Herring, 1991; Hunter, 2002).

Risk Behaviors: Internalizing colorism attitudes can contribute to higher sexual risk and substance use behavior, by African American girls (Lowman-Jackson, 2013; Townsend et al., 2010; Wallace et al., 2011). For example, Wallace, Townsend, Glasgow, & Ojie’s (2011) study of 272 African American adolescent girls found that girls who endorsed a standard of beauty consistent with colorism reported higher levels of substance use (Wallace, et al., 2011). Skin bleaching is another important risk behavior. Throughout the Caribbean, Africa, and in the United States, skin bleaching has several serious and negative health effects including mercury poisoning, permanent thinning of the skin, premature aging of the skin, increased risk of skin cancer, and skin infections. While skin bleaching fell out of favor in the US after the Civil rights movement, in many other parts of the world skin (including Africa, the Caribbean, Central and South America, Asia, and India) bleaching is reaching new heights (Hunter, 2007).

General Bias: Colorism is fairly pervasive among Black people world-wide and among other ethno-cultural groups (e.g., Mexican, Filipino, Vietnamese, Saudi, Brazilian, Japanese, and Indian people to name a few). Forty-eight percent of African Americans completing an on-line survey showed an anti-Black bias (Nosek, Greenwald & Banaji, as cited by Tummala-Narra, 2007). Further, the issue of colorism cuts both ways with negative consequences for both light and darker skinned Black people. The ethnic legitimacy or authenticity of lighter skinned Blacks is sometimes questioned or challenged while those with darker-skin tones are seen as more ethnically authentic (Hunter, 2007). Continual exposure to stereotypes can result in self-stereotyping (Sinclair, Hardin and Lowery, 2006). Essentially a person begins to behave in ways consistent with various stereotypes. Since the identity of African American girls may be influenced by the volume of negative media depictions of African American women, their identity may include remnants of negative stereotypes which can devalue their sense of their beauty and damage their selfesteem (Stephens & Phillips, 2003). The Diaspora: People of African ancestry in the US, the Caribbean, Central and South America, Africa, and other parts of the globe continue to suffer from internalized colonialism/racism, which may affect relational decisions such as: mate selection, notions of inferiority, perceptions of beauty, and social class distinctions (Gaines & Ramkissoon, 2008). This is not just a US phenomenon. For example, the Jamaican population is over 90% persons of African ancestry, yet continued privileging of lighter skin color is common. It is not uncommon for Caribbean children to be socialized that White and lighter skinned playmates are preferable (Fanon, 1967). Implicit and explicit messages are provided that Whiter features are preferred in mate selection (Gaines & Ramkissoon, 2008). These messages are consistent with the booming market and availability of skin bleaching products in Africa and throughout the Caribbean (Christopher, 2003; Also see The Jamaican healthy campaign: “Don’t Kill the Skin”). According to the World Health Organization (WHO), Nigeria has the world’s highest percentage of women (77%) using skin-lightening products. In Togo the estimates hover around 59%. Colorism exists within communities of African ancestry across the world.


Source: https://static.oprah.com/pdf/dark-girls.pdf

Are you trolling or what? I've told you multiple times that I agree that colorism exists, so why do you keep posting shit that does nothing but explain colorism. That's not what we disagree about.
 
Your view doesn't fit the data or research:

Self Esteem:
Colorism can affect how you see and feel about yourself, how you treat yourself, and your actual behaviors in various situations. Skin color is associated with self-esteem for some Black women where having a darker skin tone is associated with lower self-worth (Thompson, 2001). Sadly, this occurs in both adults and youth. A study that examined skin color in the lives of 123 African American adolescents (aged 11–19 years) found complexion to be related to self-esteem, but the study also brought additional complexity to the issue. Students who selfreported as “lighter” or “darker” had lower levels of satisfaction with their skin color than did students whose skin color was classified as “somewhere in between” (Robinson, & Ward, 1995).

Perceptions of Beauty: Skin tone can affect how we are judged by other Black people. This has been found for example in attractiveness ratings assigned to Black women (Hill, 2002). Because appearance is often central in the evaluation of women, the effect of colorism on self-esteem and well-being is stronger for African American girls and women compared to males (Thompson & Keith, 2001). Adolescent girls and women are at greater risk of self-objectification reinforced through constant societal messages and media images emphasizing the physical appearance of women and girls. For African American girls, self-objectification may appear as a preference for physical characteristics they believe will be judged more favorably (i.e., lighter skin, longer hair, keen features, fine hair texture, etc.). This may pose a particular risk for African American girls who may not conform to this standard. Wingood et al. (2002) for example, found that African American girls, who judged their physical appearance negatively, felt they had less personal control over condom use and choice of sexual partners. African American girls who adopt standards consistent with “colorism” may judge their physical appearance too harshly and may adopt risky behaviors to be seen as sexually attractive/desirable (Townsend et al., 2010).

Economic Opportunity: Skin color affects education and income for African American women. Skin color has also been found to be related to the education level of an African American woman’s spouse. Lighter-skinned women are not more likely to be married than their darker-skinned counterparts, but are likely to marry higher status spouses (Hunter 1998; Udry et al. 1971). Lighter-skinned job applicants tend to benefit from the halo effect of physical attractiveness (Etcoff, 2000); attractive people are viewed as smarter and friendlier (Mulford, 1998). Skin color discrimination affects who gets the job, pay, and success on the job (Keith and Herring, 1991; Hunter, 2002).

Risk Behaviors: Internalizing colorism attitudes can contribute to higher sexual risk and substance use behavior, by African American girls (Lowman-Jackson, 2013; Townsend et al., 2010; Wallace et al., 2011). For example, Wallace, Townsend, Glasgow, & Ojie’s (2011) study of 272 African American adolescent girls found that girls who endorsed a standard of beauty consistent with colorism reported higher levels of substance use (Wallace, et al., 2011). Skin bleaching is another important risk behavior. Throughout the Caribbean, Africa, and in the United States, skin bleaching has several serious and negative health effects including mercury poisoning, permanent thinning of the skin, premature aging of the skin, increased risk of skin cancer, and skin infections. While skin bleaching fell out of favor in the US after the Civil rights movement, in many other parts of the world skin (including Africa, the Caribbean, Central and South America, Asia, and India) bleaching is reaching new heights (Hunter, 2007).

General Bias: Colorism is fairly pervasive among Black people world-wide and among other ethno-cultural groups (e.g., Mexican, Filipino, Vietnamese, Saudi, Brazilian, Japanese, and Indian people to name a few). Forty-eight percent of African Americans completing an on-line survey showed an anti-Black bias (Nosek, Greenwald & Banaji, as cited by Tummala-Narra, 2007). Further, the issue of colorism cuts both ways with negative consequences for both light and darker skinned Black people. The ethnic legitimacy or authenticity of lighter skinned Blacks is sometimes questioned or challenged while those with darker-skin tones are seen as more ethnically authentic (Hunter, 2007). Continual exposure to stereotypes can result in self-stereotyping (Sinclair, Hardin and Lowery, 2006). Essentially a person begins to behave in ways consistent with various stereotypes. Since the identity of African American girls may be influenced by the volume of negative media depictions of African American women, their identity may include remnants of negative stereotypes which can devalue their sense of their beauty and damage their selfesteem (Stephens & Phillips, 2003). The Diaspora: People of African ancestry in the US, the Caribbean, Central and South America, Africa, and other parts of the globe continue to suffer from internalized colonialism/racism, which may affect relational decisions such as: mate selection, notions of inferiority, perceptions of beauty, and social class distinctions (Gaines & Ramkissoon, 2008). This is not just a US phenomenon. For example, the Jamaican population is over 90% persons of African ancestry, yet continued privileging of lighter skin color is common. It is not uncommon for Caribbean children to be socialized that White and lighter skinned playmates are preferable (Fanon, 1967). Implicit and explicit messages are provided that Whiter features are preferred in mate selection (Gaines & Ramkissoon, 2008). These messages are consistent with the booming market and availability of skin bleaching products in Africa and throughout the Caribbean (Christopher, 2003; Also see The Jamaican healthy campaign: “Don’t Kill the Skin”). According to the World Health Organization (WHO), Nigeria has the world’s highest percentage of women (77%) using skin-lightening products. In Togo the estimates hover around 59%. Colorism exists within communities of African ancestry across the world.


Source: https://static.oprah.com/pdf/dark-girls.pdf


This article clearly states that we do it to ourselves. It doesn't state that lighter skin has any advantage outside the black community.
 
lol I just looked at this pics again. The crazy thing is that those white chicks actually do look a lot better when they try to look black. That could be personal bias since I prefer black women. Does anyone have pics of black women that they think are trying to look white where its an actual improvement?
 
She's not?
dean-ambrose-wwe.gif
 
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