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The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: Joe Biden is the 46th President of the United States

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First- It's not illegal for super pacs to support you. Every major politician or consticuency has a super pac supporting them...biden, bernie, trump, clinton, everyone. Yet only bernie, aoc, and the like rail against super pacs that support everyone else while not acknowleging the super pacs that contribute millions to ads supporting them. I find that dirty:
Talk about a false equivalency.

I didn’t say it was illegal to take political bribes from corporations and special interests. It is perfectly legal and THAT IS THE PROBLEM.

Citizens United and other Supreme Court decisions classified for-profit corporation campaign contributions as “speech”.

It is not speech. It is not protected by the first amendment.

It is money. And in this context, it is a bribe.

When I talk about campaign contributions, I am talking about corporations that bribe politicians for political favors.

Corporations that exist in the Health Insurance Industry, the Pharma Industry, the Oil Industry, the Gun Industry, the Military Industrial Complex, the Prison Industrial Complex etc

It is not a purity test. It is a corruption test.

And when we elect politicians who fail that test. Millions of us pay with our wallets, our quality of life, and our lives.

You are trying to focus on inconsequential details while missing the larger point.


It is documented fact. Corporations spend $Billions buying politicians and get $Trillions in political favors.

Biden had a campaign fundraising event with elite corporate donors and literally said “don’t worry - nothing is going to change”

“Nothing is going to change.”

At a time when half the country makes $30,000 a year...

When a $400 expense breaks the Budget of 40% of Americans...

At a time when the wealthiest three families now own more wealth than the bottom half of the country...

Does that sound like someone who has the people’s best interest at heart?

- The PEOPLE ... of whom he is campaigning to represent.

But he is exactly the same as Bernie, right?

Ok - So who are these dangerous Super PACs that support Bernie Sanders - the ones that you equivocate to for-profit corporations.

First of all - in 2020, the answer is ZERO. His campaign is funded entirely through small dollar donations. Over a million people donating about $20 a piece.

Let’s look at 2016. I read your article and it didn’t show me anything I didn’t already know.

Sanders received funds from -

- National Nurses Union
- Americans Socially United, &
- Our Revolution

So a union and professional association of registered nurses; a Political Action Committee; and a Grass Roots Non Profit organization.

You want to compare these organizations to For Profit Corporations.

Your implication is that a group of Nurses, a PAC with $90,000 worth of Total Receipts, and an non profit organization with a stated goal of “Elevating Political Consciousness” - are collectively bribing Bernie Sanders.

Because of their overwhelming contributions from four years ago -


They are going to convince him to NOT support Medicare for All, or the Green New Deal, or a Wealth Tax, or Immigration Reform, or restrictionist the Criminal Justice System, or Paid Family Leave, or a $15 Minimum Wage - or any other policy meant to help the PEOPLE of this country.

I mean all of that is just antithetical to what Nurses, and Democracy advocates stand for.


Boy oh boy I can really see him screwing over the American people to appeal to these groups.

Sanders has been in Politics for 40 years. Can you point to one time that has happened?

Can you find one example where he represented corporate interests instead of his constituents?

I’ll wait...

You find that “dirty”. I find your argument pretty “weak”.
But since he and Joe Biden are the “exact same” , let’s do this same exercise with Mr. “No Malarkey” a bit later and see if anything comes up.

I wonder what we’ll find.


As far as AOC goes...we'll see. Word is that the progressives are already winking and nodding to groups to use their money in primary fights against moderates. What i do know she has no real legislative success yet or progressive havent really shown the ability to turn red seats blue like the moderates did in 2018.

But i guess everybody's bought and paid for except a few precious progressives...lol.

Are you saying AOC wants to get corporate Democrats who work for corporate interests and sympathize with Republicans replaced by Democrats who will actually work for the American people they represent?

Good.

Are you trying to imply that this is “dirty” because so-called Moderates have graciously welcomed her with open arms and would never do something like primary her or other Progressives?

Hilarious.

It is a publicly documented fact that AOC is loathed by the Democratic Establishment - spearheaded by the Democratic Leader in Congress, Nancy Pelosi. AOC currently has Nine Primary Challengers for her seat.

Nine Moderates trying to take her seat. And you should see the rhetoric that has been used to describe her.

AOC supporting Progressives vs Corporate Democrats is like AOC supporting Democrats vs Republicans.

They are ideologically on different planets.

The funniest part of this post is that you dismissed AOC of having “no legislative success”. Jesus dude - you are pretty biased.

She’s done more than 95% of politicians that have been there for decades. Even Republicans admit that she is a formidable force in Politics.

What has AOC accomplished?

  • Became the youngest congresswoman in United States history.
  • Co-sponsored 10 Pieces of Legislation
  • Co-sponsored one of the largest most ambitious Resolutions of this generation
  • Co-sponsored a Resolution that garnered the formal and rhetorical support from the majority of Candidates for President of the United States (Never been done before by a Freshman Congress Person)
  • Attracted a larger following than most members of Senior Leadership in Congress
  • Transformed the entire dynamic of politics in the modern era
Yeah - but she’s some girl who doesn’t play nice with grown ups right? You got it fam.

And Progressives have not had success in Politics because Progressives have never had a movement in Politics. This is largely because corporations own the political establishment.

Progressives are building the movement that will end that.

Just wait a couple years and your misguided beliefs about the “electability” of Progressives will be proven foolish.
 
Bidens background on this issue were good enough for obama to select him as vp. Clintons were good enough for obama to endorse her. But i guess obama is on the take too.
This quote shows how little you know what you are talking about.

Obama picked Biden because Obama is a Centrist who believed he needed to cooperate with Republicans. So he picked Republican Politician who was a Democrat in name only.


Obama catered to Republicans to curry favor with them.
I ask you - HOW DID THAT WORK OUT.

Obama picked Hilary because he is a Centrist. Just like Hilary.

This is not a mystery.


It is also why as good intentioned as Obama was, he was not as effective as he could have been. We don’t need to work with Republicans. We need to defeat them.

As far as the mainstream media persecution of the progressives...again laughable.

Are you trying to make the argument that the corporate media doesn’t have an Agenda?

- The same media that is driven by business interests and literally owned by large multinational corporations?

You are arguing that their agenda DOES NOT involve stopping progressives from significantly reducing the sources of revenue that represent the sole reason for their existence?


Ima let you cook. I don’t even understand how you can make that argument with a straight face.

And everybody lobbies...oil companies, enviromentalists, renewable energy companies, health insurance industry, etc. You chose the most extreme example.

Didnt stop the obama administration from trying to end oil subsidies and limit emissions. Nearly every moderate presidential candidate is campaigning on a public option...the health industry cant be too happy with that.
See ... This is the fundamental flaw with Centrism.

Centrist Democrats have conceded in nearly every area of policy to Republicans and Corporations for 40 years. Then they get these crumbs in the right direction and celebrate them like crowning achievements.

Obama “tried to end oil subsidies” And “tried to limit emissions”.

Fam - that’s not good enough. I’m assuming you know the sweeping and systemic nature of the climate crisis and how mild action that wasn’t even successful is nothing to be bragging about.

Candidates are pushing for the “Public option”. because they have no choice. Bernie has called out how immoral the current system is and now it would be a death sentence to support it and run for President.

But the Healthcare Industry vastly prefers the Public Option to Medicare for all. Not only does it guarantee the existence of Private Insurance Companies (which Medicare for All functionally abolishes), it maintains Co-Pays, Deductibles, AND Premiums - in other words it maintains the immoral system that we have.

What’s the difference?

It creates a two tiered system where the Private Insurance Companies can insure the the healthiest and people with means, and the “Public Option” can carry all of the sickest and poorest people in the country.

And because this will create a two tiered system with an un even burden on the Public Option, they can then lie and say how much “better” Private Insurance is than “Medicare for All” (AKA the shitty Public Option that candidates are calling Medicare for All).

And then the Healthcare Industry can win the political battle and legislate away the Public Option - and eliminate the the threat of Medicare for All.

Yeah - The Healthcare industry “can’t be too happy with that”. They would much rather have Bernie Sanders and Medicare for All!

:-|
[/spoiler]

Secondly- doesnt matter who we "put up" against trump. Biden is still up in nearly every major national poll despite his public record and private dealings being on put on blast. If Bernie wins iowa and flips it...good for him. I will root and vote for him against trump. Do you think aoc and bernie supporters will do the same?
Ok so let’s tackle this “electability” question head on.

The only reason you and others think Biden is the most “electable” is because the media told you to believe that. Literally they have asked people that is what they said.

Just like the media told us Hilary was more “electable”.

How did that work out?

They were wrong about Hilary.

And they are wrong about Joe Biden.

Despite the millions in free TV advertisements for Biden, Bernie is STILL winning in multiple national polls. And he is just getting started. He has over a million campaign contributions from actual voters and hundreds of thousands of volunteers. Meanwhile, Biden is barely coming in third or fourth in quarterly fundraising. Corporate money is drying up.

Which one has stronger staying power?

Which one has a stronger following?

Which one has the stronger grassroots movement?

Which one do you think will excite the base more in a general election?


Put that aside, and realize that national polls don’t mean anything when it comes to elections. Just like they didn’t mean anything when Hilary was on top in the polls.

Elections are decided by states.

Have you ever heard of momentum in Politics?

Take a look at who is winning in the first two early states for primary voting: Iowa, and New Hampshire.

Bernie.

Guess who is, empirically, the most liked politician in the entire country?

Hint: it’s not Joe Biden.

Guess who has the most energized based of all Candidates in the field.

Mr. Sanders.

We haven’t even gotten to Biden’s record and why it is so horrendous it should disqualify him to be a candidate for President on merit alone; and how Trump would use it to eviscerate him in a General Election.

You want to talk about things that don’t play well and should be extremely concerning for white working class people, black people, and virtually all Americans.

Observe the following Facts.

Joe Biden Tried to Cut Social Security, Medicaid, and Medicare for 40 Years

Just some of the most popular programs in the nation’s history that cover 100 Million+ Americans. Biden has fought to cut it for the majority of his career.

Joe Biden Stripped Bankruptcy Protection From Millions Just Before a Recession

Just 40 Million Americans who have fallen prey to absurdly high interest rate, predatory lending, false promises and a lifetime of insurmountable debt in the midst of economic challenges.

Billionaires can subsidize bad business decisions by bankrupting companies limitless times to discharge their debt and put people out on the street. But if a student wants relief from an unfair system while trying to climb the economic latter - they deserved to be crushed by that debt for their entire lives.

Joe Biden did that.


Joe Biden didn’t just vote for the Crime Bill. He was the architect


  • Mass Incarceration?
  • War on Drugs?
  • Destroying the Black Community?

No Problem.
You can thank Joe Biden for that.

Joe Biden pushed aggressively for the Iraq War
  • 4500 American Corpses
  • 20,000+ Wounded, Disabled, PTSD riddled Americans
  • 300,000 Iraqi Civilians
  • Several $Trillion Dollars wasted
  • Leaving the region WORSE than when we started
  • Longest War in US history still continuing today
Great Judgement for a Commander in Chief!




Now take a hard look at those policy decisions by Joe Biden and consider whose interests they served -

The American people or Corporate Interests?

In case you were having trouble, here is a cheat sheet of the industry affiliations of wealthy corporations that have contributed to Biden’s campaign.
  • Wall Street
  • Private Prisons
  • Oil & Gas
  • Real Estate
  • Healthcare
Do you see a correlation?

Before you tell me “all politicians have a bad record”.

You’re wrong.

There is at least one in the Primary that doesn’t. He has 40 years of doing the right thing when it wasn’t popular.

I’m voting for him.

You should too.
 
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Any Yang gangers at abw?

Imagine supporting this trash ass empty pandering


Him or Bernie got my vote, depending on who's the strongest at the end. Really like what both stand for and have displayed. Neither one of them puts themselves out to far to have to slurp up constituents over something they dont really stand behind.
 
You know better than that. I can tell this is a very sensitive topic for you given your reactions. You know I'm not the type to just talk out of my ass.

- I'm saying there will never be a balance between rich or poor because one cannot coexist without the other or in other words "Game Theory". Not everyone can win at the same time. And one trade off provided one with less and one with more. If I spend money to buy baseball tickets, I'm short the amount but I get the experience to watch something once. The person with my money now has more to spend or invest. Some people have different skills society will value more than others. Basketball players get paid millions versus nurses. If I control my own real estate businesses or control factories, I can pay myself a salary of a $1, expense everything I spend money on and pay little in taxes. Meanwhile my net worth increases significantly due to capital gains and the growth in the value of my businesses. It's not so black and white. What will change tho is the way people see it.


- I never assumed one was greedy, you did. The issue is not everyone's talents will be hailed in the same light. Some people will be born with disabilities or other circumstances. Some people will have a greater love or work ethic than another person, some talents will earn more money etc. It's more than just money also, it's also a quality education to help educate people on how to use money and establish credit. Especially early on. There are more people on here more interested in gay threads than there are in the business threads. Tell me I'm lying. If I made a thread about semi nude chicks, it gets more responses than a thread teaching a person how to turn 10k into 100k in 5 years. That's another thing. Taxes should rise so you can generate a greater surplus in the economy which can in turn be used to fund things like education, infrastructure and other things. But it's still not going to balance the wealth gap.


- You need to be way more specific. If you're talking about profits or investments such as capital gains the average person can take advantage of that too, in fact it's largely encouraged by government to do so because then Americans are saving and can consume assets actually beneficial to the economy and as a result pass down wealth. That's why vehicles like a 401k have huge tax consequences if you try to take money out. You work hard to get to that level and you get to enjoy the fruits of your labour, i.e. incentives and tax breaks for your businesses so you can invest more in your employees' benefits, subsidies to help you fund new facilities because your company can produce jobs. Become an entrepreneur, live the American Dream and reap the rewards. The question to ask is what's too much between rich and poor ? Say wages and salaries on average are 100k but the rich have $1 billion is that still too much ? Even if the average salary for a single person were 100k that means the price level of goods would likely rise too and eventually over time that 100k wont be as much as it was. This is why politicians also cant just say "fuck Corporate America" and just give everything to the poor or middle class. You need them both to help create and balance your economy and economic growth. Whether you like it or not. We're all in the same boat steering a ship.


I think the disconnect here is that you are getting into details that are not germane to this conversation.

We can spend pages discussing the nuances of economic theory, the best methods for growing equity and building Cashflow, tactical investment practices across business, real estate, paper assets, and commodities.
However, If we agree on first principles, all of that sophistication is moot and irrelevant to this conversation.

Most of what you mentioned in your post has a small impact on the core topic we are discussing: Historic levels of wealth inequality in America.

Half the country, about 150 Million+ people in America make $30,000 a year or less.

40% of Americans cannot afford A $500 unexpected expense.

43 Million Americans are living in poverty.

43 Million Americans are living in poverty.
What percentage of THOSE people would benefit from learning how to execute an iron condor, or a Butterfly call / put combination via options trading; or mastering sovereign fundamentals to try their hand at the forex Market; or appropriately assessing the rehab cost, LTV, points, interest and potential Cap Rate for a vacant property they are looking to invest in?

Fam ... these folks are just trying to put food on the table - and they can barely afford that.

We must crawl, before we can walk, before we can ever hope to run.

We must crawl, before we can walk, before we can ever hope to run.
You are talking about millionaire athletes and the relative value of advanced skills.

  • Can we just give people healthcare?
  • Can we get them a minimum wage that doesn’t force them to starve?
  • Can we ask Billionaires to pay taxes so that we can redistribute wealth to the people and give them opportunity to breathe?
And maybe one day be able to breathe for long enough to consider actually investing and building long term wealth?

I see the conversation you are having as fundamentally different than what we began talking about.

I see the conversation you are having as fundamentally different than what we began talking about.
It also appears that you are using straw man arguments that may not have full context or are unrelated to what my position is.

For example, @Sion - I know you are defending the relative merit of the 401K system as an example of “average” Americans having an opportunity to build wealth and “take advantage of capital gains” in any sort of meaningful way.

If that is one of your arguments, I would need an entire post to refute that claim.

For now, I’ll assume I’m mistaken.
You also mentioned the following -

“You work hard to get to that level and you get to enjoy the fruits of your labour”.

This is a straw man argument.

I never claimed business owners should not get the “fruits of their labor.”
The question is how exorbitantly substantial should those fruits be and how much should we distort society and punish the lower classes to accommodate those fruits.
I say - definitely not at the absurd level of income inequality that we have now.
I don’t think that is a radical position.

We should also be carful in presuming all wealthy people have inherently “worked harder” than everyone else. That is a very misleading claim.

Wealth like culture is cumulative and compounding.

In America, 60% of wealth is inherited.


So “hard work” is not causual or even a necessary prerequisite to wealth. As you know education and exposure plays a large role as well. That is largely dependent on who you are and how you grew up.
There are some people on food stamps that work twice as “hard” as Millionaires.
But perhaps that Millionaire was born into the right family and had the right education and was afforded the right experiences and leveraged the right connections and inherited the right business?
Maybe he only has to “work” 10 hours a week. Maybe he has Cashflow producing assets where he doesn’t have to “work” at all.

Are we going to demonize the 50 yr old single mom on food stamps for “not working hard” enough?

While celebrating the wealthy 20 yr old man because he has “worked hard” and now he gets to enjoy the “fruits of his labor”.


If only she just pulled herself up by her bootstraps, right ...

This is where I argue you have to supplement capitalism with common sense structures to facilitate liberty and justice for ALL ... not just some.

You keep talking about equality of outcome. Yes that is impossible.

We don’t have to litigate that.

I am talking about equality of OPPORTUNITY. The historic levels of wealth inequality in this country reflect a sever imbalance in Economic OPPORTUNITY.

That’s what we need to correct.

And high brow entrepreneurship and investment strategies are NOT going to put food on the table for the masses who are struggling to get by.
  • They need jobs
  • They need healthcare
  • They need living wages
  • They need economic opportunity.

And yes the wealthiest among us also need to actually pay trier taxes to help make it happen.
 
- the problem isnt just putting money in people's hands, it's also educating them as well. There's no manual on how to start a business and most businesses fail. It's also a mindset, not everyone is geared for that. Only a few are.


- taxing multinational corporations PROPERLY isn't easy because they operate in different jurisdictions and provide jobs and more for a single economy. Also not all businesses are the same, if I set up a hedge fund in a country I'm not actually taxed on my investments until I sell them, because most my gains can be capital gains, I'd only have to pay tax on service or management fees. Same thing can work for banks or insurance companies, insurance companies have lots of loopholes because if and when things go wrong they're at greater risk. What I'm getting to is you want your nation to entice foreign investment but you also want to be fair. You can tax them but you cannot stop them from making a dollar. Some countries are more attractive for business than others. Few countries want to come to Canada because we have too much regulation, takes longer to get things to enter certain industries, taxes are high (not just income taxes, everything is imported and because of our high tariffs retailers overprice things, Jordans are $250-350 here, in the US they're half that) and it's also expensive to live in most major cities. Lastly with multinational corporations, they can change jurisdictions and headquarter in a different country or territory making it even tougher to tax them.


- Back in those days when tax rates were higher America was significantly smaller, if I'm not mistake 90% tax rate was in the 1950s which makes sense because you had to recoup from WWII and had to race to make sure the economy became #1. Also people live a lot better now than they did in the 50s. The 50s were not the most profitable time in America, if were referring to GDP growth, America was significantly smaller back then than it is now. The 90s and 2010s were some of the most profitable periods in America depending on what metric you're looking at. Tax rates must and will increase but it'll never be enough and it'll never be satisfactory, if it jumps to 50% again people will still be mad that corporations are profiting period. Btw 90% tax rate is beyond excessive. 50% I can understand but 90% is ridiculous and not competitive at all.


- lastly, it's tough because politicians do have to work with corporate especially on matters pertaining to the economy and jobs. It sounds good to say fuck the rich but the reality of the matter is, you do need both sides of the spectrum to exist.

No one is saying “Fuck the Rich”. I am just saying we should not bow down and worship them at our own expense, either



It sounds like your points can be summed up as follows:

“People need education”

I’m pretty sure no one disagrees with that. I fail to see how it runs counter to my argument.


“It’s hard to Tax the rich”

Ok. Lots of things in life are hard. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t do them.


“In the 50s America was smaller and funding WWII, so a 90% Tax Rate was more appropriate”

Well, now America is bigger with more mouths to feed and more complex “assets” to pour capital into; so she needs more revenue to become solvent and remain that way.

I am not advocating for 90% tax rate. I used that point to demonstrate how ridiculous is to say that higher taxes are inherently evil and that no measure of success can come from them. Or that anything higher than we have today is exorbitantly high.

This is categorically false.


“The Government has to work with Corporations.”

@Sion you are a businessman and an investor. You understand leverage and the importance of relationships.

Just because the Government has to work with Corporations, that doesn’t mean it should abdicate its responsibility to the people from whom it derives its power.

That’s like a Real Estate Agent saying -

“Well I have to work with this other agent so, I guess we are selling your house for $300,000 less than it is worth - because that’s what the other Agent wants ”

No. An Agent represent their clients.
The government represents the people.

If they have to work with other agents; they work with other agents but that should not impact doing what is best for the people they represent.

This is especially the case when one of the “Agents” in the transaction has leverage - which in this case, the government does.

United States Corporations do not exist without the United States.

Of course we work with corporations and incentivize their cooperatiom but we also don’t let them destroy our society with tremendous amounts of greed and cruelty.

Right now - what is happening is NOT

“what’s best for the People“

We need to fix that.
 
Some of yall mofos are off your rocker

As for what Hillary said their is some truth to it but as a political influencer (I hate that term and how impactful it is) she should have shut the fuck up
 
Good to know. And i dont think i ever insinuated bernie himself wouldnt support the nominee...but we all know how his supporters, some progressives, and the hotep crowd are...hopefully they feel the same as you

Another False implication.

Did you know that MORE Bernie supports voted for Hilary Clinton than Hilary Clinton supporters voted for Barack Obama?

How many times have you heard about how “horrible” Clinton Supporters were?

I mean logically - they were even worse than Bernie Bros, right?


This is what you call a narrative planted by the media
 
L
Don’t you what the fuck me. Whoever coming out this mess for the Democrats is gonna be a choice between them or Trump. I don’t really like any of em but given the choice... this is all we got.
it ain't gonna be him and the person who beats Trump is the person who is supported that's it that's the game that's...

It's like people think Trump introduced white supremacy and policies to subjugate vulnerable groups.. He did that


On another note the political stannery is ridiculous

From all quarters

The Bernie bros
The Beyonces
Yang Gang
 
L
it ain't gonna be him and the person who beats Trump is the person who is supported that's it that's the game that's...

It's like people think Trump introduced white supremacy and policies to subjugate vulnerable groups.. He did that


On another note the political stannery is ridiculous

From all quarters

The Bernie bros
The Beyonces
Yang Gang

I don’t really have a dog in this fight personally, so I’m trying to keep an open mind on these people. From what I seen tho there’s no clear cut person that I feel is overwhelmingly worthy of the nomination.
 
Talk about a false equivalency.

I didn’t say it was illegal to take political bribes from corporations and special interests. It is perfectly legal and THAT IS THE PROBLEM.

Citizens United and other Supreme Court decisions classified for-profit corporation campaign contributions as “speech”.

It is not speech. It is not protected by the first amendment.

It is money. And in this context, it is a bribe.

When I talk about campaign contributions, I am talking about corporations that bribe politicians for political favors.

Corporations that exist in the Health Insurance Industry, the Pharma Industry, the Oil Industry, the Gun Industry, the Military Industrial Complex, the Prison Industrial Complex etc

It is not a purity test. It is a corruption test.

And when we elect politicians who fail that test. Millions of us pay with our wallets, our quality of life, and our lives.


You are trying to focus on inconsequential details while missing the larger point.


It is documented fact. Corporations spend $Billions buying politicians and get $Trillions in political favors.

Biden had a campaign fundraising event with elite corporate donors and literally said “don’t worry - nothing is going to change”

“Nothing is going to change.”

At a time when half the country makes $30,000 a year...

When a $400 expense breaks the Budget of 40% of Americans...

At a time when the wealthiest three families now own more wealth than the bottom half of the country...

Does that sound like someone who has the people’s best interest at heart?

- The PEOPLE ... of whom he is campaigning to represent.

But he is exactly the same as Bernie, right?

Ok - So who are these dangerous Super PACs that support Bernie Sanders - the ones that you equivocate to for-profit corporations.

First of all - in 2020, the answer is ZERO. His campaign is funded entirely through small dollar donations. Over a million people donating about $20 a piece.

Let’s look at 2016. I read your article and it didn’t show me anything I didn’t already know.

Sanders received funds from -

- National Nurses Union
- Americans Socially United, &
- Our Revolution

So a union and professional association of registered nurses; a Political Action Committee; and a Grass Roots Non Profit organization.

You want to compare these organizations to For Profit Corporations.

Your implication is that a group of Nurses, a PAC with $90,000 worth of Total Receipts, and an non profit organization with a stated goal of “Elevating Political Consciousness” - are collectively bribing Bernie Sanders.

Because of their overwhelming contributions from four years ago -


They are going to convince him to NOT support Medicare for All, or the Green New Deal, or a Wealth Tax, or Immigration Reform, or restrictionist the Criminal Justice System, or Paid Family Leave, or a $15 Minimum Wage - or any other policy meant to help the PEOPLE of this country.

I mean all of that is just antithetical to what Nurses, and Democracy advocates stand for.


Boy oh boy I can really see him screwing over the American people to appeal to these groups.

Sanders has been in Politics for 40 years. Can you point to one time that has happened?

Can you find one example where he represented corporate interests instead of his constituents?

I’ll wait...

You find that “dirty”. I find your argument pretty “weak”.
But since he and Joe Biden are the “exact same” , let’s do this same exercise with Mr. “No Malarkey” a bit later and see if anything comes up.

I wonder what we’ll find.


Are you saying AOC wants to get corporate Democrats who work for corporate interests and sympathize with Republicans replaced by Democrats who will actually work for the American people they represent?

Good.

Are you trying to imply that this is “dirty” because so-called Moderates have graciously welcomed her with open arms and would never do something like primary her or other Progressives?

Hilarious.

It is a publicly documented fact that AOC is loathed by the Democratic Establishment - spearheaded by the Democratic Leader in Congress, Nancy Pelosi. AOC currently has Nine Primary Challengers for her seat.

Nine Moderates trying to take her seat. And you should see the rhetoric that has been used to describe her.

AOC supporting Progressives vs Corporate Democrats is like AOC supporting Democrats vs Republicans.

They are ideologically on different planets.

The funniest part of this post is that you dismissed AOC of having “no legislative success”. Jesus dude - you are pretty biased.

She’s done more than 95% of politicians that have been there for decades. Even Republicans admit that she is a formidable force in Politics.

What has AOC accomplished?

  • Became the youngest congresswoman in United States history.
  • Co-sponsored 10 Pieces of Legislation
  • Co-sponsored one of the largest most ambitious Resolutions of this generation
  • Co-sponsored a Resolution that garnered the formal and rhetorical support from the majority of Candidates for President of the United States (Never been done before by a Freshman Congress Person)
  • Attracted a larger following than most members of Senior Leadership in Congress
  • Transformed the entire dynamic of politics in the modern era
Yeah - but she’s some girl who doesn’t play nice with grown ups right? You got it fam.

And Progressives have not had success in Politics because Progressives have never had a movement in Politics. This is largely because corporations own the political establishment.

Progressives are building the movement that will end that.

Just wait a couple years and your misguided beliefs about the “electability” of Progressives will be proven foolish.

Lol at the irony of this post being right below a post about bernie having to apologize for his supporters slandering biden as corrupt

Either way at this point getting rid of citizens united is a democratic party line issue. Everybody is for it...bernie, biden, warren, everybody.

Yet only one candidates supporters have come out and called everybody who accepts corporate money corrupt. No matter how miniscule that money is compared to that candidates and particularly the party total fundraising (obama, clinton). No matter how notoriously awful that candidate is at fundraising from big donors corporate and individual (biden). No matter how much that candidate has repeatedly put out policies that work against corporate interests (warren).

But obama, biden, clinton, warren and every other moderate...theyre all corrupt right?

:kobe:
But who knows how much of this soft "grassroots" money is being floated around to support progressive causes (as you can see for bernie at least millions) But far be it from me to accuse lol

As far as aoc...more accomplished than 95% of representatives? Bruh if you dont get that garbage outta here man lol. Again no legislative accomplishments as in sponsoring and making amendments to bills that actually became law. That shit reminds me of when the republicans came in during the obama years and wrote a whole bunch of garbage ass bills that never saw the light of day.

And check it...i like aoc and alot of her policies. But you know what her policies need?

Moderate support.

And thanks to the evil democratic establishment that may be a reality. Arizona may have two democratic senators which was unheard of. Iowa, georgia, nc, and kansas may flip...and they aint flipping to progressive candidates or if progressives try to savage those candidates.

So yeah no success...but of course moderates may flip the senate and then progressives will try to claim that as their success.
 
This quote shows how little you know what you are talking about.

Obama picked Biden because Obama is a Centrist who believed he needed to cooperate with Republicans. So he picked Republican Politician who was a Democrat in name only.


Obama catered to Republicans to curry favor with them.
I ask you - HOW DID THAT WORK OUT.

Obama picked Hilary because he is a Centrist. Just like Hilary.

This is not a mystery.


It is also why as good intentioned as Obama was, he was not as effective as he could have been. We don’t need to work with Republicans. We need to defeat them.



Are you trying to make the argument that the corporate media doesn’t have an Agenda?

- The same media that is driven by business interests and literally owned by large multinational corporations?

You are arguing that their agenda DOES NOT involve stopping progressives from significantly reducing the sources of revenue that represent the sole reason for their existence?


Ima let you cook. I don’t even understand how you can make that argument with a straight face.



See ... This is the fundamental flaw with Centrism.

Centrist Democrats have conceded in nearly every area of policy to Republicans and Corporations for 40 years. Then they get these crumbs in the right direction and celebrate them like crowning achievements.

Obama “tried to end oil subsidies” And “tried to limit emissions”.

Fam - that’s not good enough. I’m assuming you know the sweeping and systemic nature of the climate crisis and how mild action that wasn’t even successful is nothing to be bragging about.

Candidates are pushing for the “Public option”. because they have no choice. Bernie has called out how immoral the current system is and now it would be a death sentence to support it and run for President.

But the Healthcare Industry vastly prefers the Public Option to Medicare for all. Not only does it guarantee the existence of Private Insurance Companies (which Medicare for All functionally abolishes), it maintains Co-Pays, Deductibles, AND Premiums - in other words it maintains the immoral system that we have.

What’s the difference?

It creates a two tiered system where the Private Insurance Companies can insure the the healthiest and people with means, and the “Public Option” can carry all of the sickest and poorest people in the country.

And because this will create a two tiered system with an un even burden on the Public Option, they can then lie and say how much “better” Private Insurance is than “Medicare for All” (AKA the shitty Public Option that candidates are calling Medicare for All).

And then the Healthcare Industry can win the political battle and legislate away the Public Option - and eliminate the the threat of Medicare for All.

Yeah - The Healthcare industry “can’t be too happy with that”. They would much rather have Bernie Sanders and Medicare for All!


Ok so let’s tackle this “electability” question head on.

The only reason you and others think Biden is the most “electable” is because the media told you to believe that. Literally they have asked people that is what they said.

Just like the media told us Hilary was more “electable”.

How did that work out?

They were wrong about Hilary.

And they are wrong about Joe Biden.

Despite the millions in free TV advertisements for Biden, Bernie is STILL winning in multiple national polls. And he is just getting started. He has over a million campaign contributions from actual voters and hundreds of thousands of volunteers. Meanwhile, Biden is barely coming in third or fourth in quarterly fundraising. Corporate money is drying up.

Which one has stronger staying power?

Which one has a stronger following?

Which one has the stronger grassroots movement?

Which one do you think will excite the base more in a general election?


Put that aside, and realize that national polls don’t mean anything when it comes to elections. Just like they didn’t mean anything when Hilary was on top in the polls.

Elections are decided by states.

Have you ever heard of momentum in Politics?

Take a look at who is winning in the first two early states for primary voting: Iowa, and New Hampshire.

Bernie.

Guess who is, empirically, the most liked politician in the entire country?

Hint: it’s not Joe Biden.

Guess who has the most energized based of all Candidates in the field.

Mr. Sanders.

We haven’t even gotten to Biden’s record and why it is so horrendous it should disqualify him to be a candidate for President on merit alone; and how Trump would use it to eviscerate him in a General Election.

You want to talk about things that don’t play well and should be extremely concerning for white working class people, black people, and virtually all Americans.

Observe the following Facts.

Joe Biden Tried to Cut Social Security, Medicaid, and Medicare for 40 Years

Just some of the most popular programs in the nation’s history that cover 100 Million+ Americans. Biden has fought to cut it for the majority of his career.

Joe Biden Stripped Bankruptcy Protection From Millions Just Before a Recession

Just 40 Million Americans who have fallen prey to absurdly high interest rate, predatory lending, false promises and a lifetime of insurmountable debt in the midst of economic challenges.

Billionaires can subsidize bad business decisions by bankrupting companies limitless times to discharge their debt and put people out on the street. But if a student wants relief from an unfair system while trying to climb the economic latter - they deserved to be crushed by that debt for their entire lives.

Joe Biden did that.


Joe Biden didn’t just vote for the Crime Bill. He was the architect


  • Mass Incarceration?
  • War on Drugs?
  • Destroying the Black Community?

No Problem.
You can thank Joe Biden for that.

Joe Biden pushed aggressively for the Iraq War
  • 4500 American Corpses
  • 20,000+ Wounded, Disabled, PTSD riddled Americans
  • 300,000 Iraqi Civilians
  • Several $Trillion Dollars wasted
  • Leaving the region WORSE than when we started
  • Longest War in US history still continuing today
Great Judgement for a Commander in Chief!




Now take a hard look at those policy decisions by Joe Biden and consider whose interests they served -

The American people or Corporate Interests?

In case you were having trouble, here is a cheat sheet of the industry affiliations of wealthy corporations that have contributed to Biden’s campaign.
  • Wall Street
  • Private Prisons
  • Oil & Gas
  • Real Estate
  • Healthcare
Do you see a correlation?

Before you tell me “all politicians have a bad record”.

You’re wrong.

There is at least one in the Primary that doesn’t. He has 40 years of doing the right thing when it wasn’t popular.

I’m voting for him.

You should too.

Aite so let me ask you again, there's no way that obama would select his #2 or his successor if they were so corrupt right? Or maybe obama was corrupt too smh.

Im not even going touch that trump like talking point that the media is so biased against progressives. Not even sure where your going there unless you want state run media. But your notion is ridiculous...like aoc and progressives dont get enough publicity and glowing pieces. Or if biden is hailed as some saint and isnt viewed in a similar light to the msm as sanders as two old tired white men. But again you just gloss over the war that bernie supporters wage online against certain candidates and moderate politicians.

And centrist ceding every issue? Laughable and just a progressive talking point devoid of all reality. Like a two party system just doesnt exist in the united states lol. Or even if most americans agree with every progressive policy.

Yeah the obama administartion tried to end oil subsidies, placed emission caps, taxes and all sort of enviromental regulations, entered multinational climate agreements, huge investments in renewable energies. I guess thats nothing right? Especially in a country where the other party is all too happy to remind the general american public that it isnt ready for an sizeable increase in electric bills or gas prices or the loss of manufacturing and fossil fuel jobs.

Not going to get into the weeds of medicare for all right now (but we can have that discussion). But the public option being some vast conspiracy of industry is bs. Moderates are campaigning on it because its popular. Much more popular than mfa. Period. And it was a democratic sticking point before bernie.

And im not totally against mfa. But fact is people dont want to see a massive tax increase even with the best estimates. And they dont buy that the person who hates corporations is now gonna rely on corporations to split that tax difference with salary increases. Shocking though to see such a flippant attitude to an entitlement that benefits millions. And you contadict yourself so much bruh...if a government run option is so much more efficient and cost effective for the majority...that should lead more people to mfa right?

As far as electability goes...we will have to see. Fact of the matter is as flawed as biden is as a candidate, if bernie cant beat him then thats telling. And we can make the polls look how they want all day long. I can show you a bunch of polls on how biden outperforms bernie against trump in battleground states all day long.

And i dont have a particular candidate im pulling for yet. Bernie and his supporters are increasingly ridiculous. Biden has a shitty legislative record but i thought he was a solid vp. I like Warren personally but her policies are unclear. Klobuchar would probably be the best at getting things done and progressing the country but she doesnt have charisma. Bottom line is, whoever is the nominee needs full support.
 
Lol at the irony of this post being right below a post about bernie having to apologize for his supporters slandering biden as corrupt

Either way at this point getting rid of citizens united is a democratic party line issue. Everybody is for it...bernie, biden, warren, everybody.

Yet only one candidates supporters have come out and called everybody who accepts corporate money corrupt. No matter how miniscule that money is compared to that candidates and particularly the party total fundraising (obama, clinton). No matter how notoriously awful that candidate is at fundraising from big donors corporate and individual (biden). No matter how much that candidate has repeatedly put out policies that work against corporate interests (warren).

But obama, biden, clinton, warren and every other moderate...theyre all corrupt right?

:kobe:
But who knows how much of this soft "grassroots" money is being floated around to support progressive causes (as you can see for bernie at least millions) But far be it from me to accuse lol

As far as aoc...more accomplished than 95% of representatives? Bruh if you dont get that garbage outta here man lol. Again no legislative accomplishments as in sponsoring and making amendments to bills that actually became law. That shit reminds me of when the republicans came in during the obama years and wrote a whole bunch of garbage ass bills that never saw the light of day.

And check it...i like aoc and alot of her policies. But you know what her policies need?

Moderate support.

And thanks to the evil democratic establishment that may be a reality. Arizona may have two democratic senators which was unheard of. Iowa, georgia, nc, and kansas may flip...and they aint flipping to progressive candidates or if progressives try to savage those candidates.

So yeah no success...but of course moderates may flip the senate and then progressives will try to claim that as their success.

Bruh .... you can post all the salty Kobe Bryant gifs on the internet.

But.. . You just referred to someone calling Biden Corrupt as “slander”. My Lord. You have absolutely no earthly idea what you are talking about...

I DARE you to spend 15 minitues researching ”Biden and corruption”. See what you find.

If you actually look - you will Find
Not opinions. Not Punditry. Not biased narratives.

But DOCUMENTED FACTS with receipts.
Do you care about facts??? Or Not.

Bernie shouldn’t have apologized because everything pointed out in the piece was a truthful and substantiated.

He is way too soft on Biden because he is a nice guy, despite the media painting him out to be evil and malicious. I think he made a mistake in apologizing for one of his surrogates pointing out Biden’s terrible record of political favors that hurt the American people and help corporations.

I am still waiting for you to point out the CORPORATIONS who contributed to Bernie Sanders campaign AND the supposed political favors he reciprocated to said Corporations.

I’ll keep waiting ...


But for you to claim that “it doesn’t matter” that Presidential Candidates are accepting $ millions in corporate bribes and selling out the interest of the American people for them is insane.


In fact you are less upset about Politicians bypassing the American people and Democracy for Status and corporate money; than you are about Bernie Sanders calling it out!

Think about that.

Fam - these politicians don’t even matter to our every day lives. ALL THAT MATTERS is the policy.

You are more concerned about Joe Biden’s feelings than Joe Biden voting to take away financial protections of tens of millions of Americans struggling.


You are more concerned about Joe Biden’s feelings than Joe Biden voting to take away hundreds of millions of vulnerable Americans’ Healthcrae.


You are more concerned about Joe Biden’s feelings than Joe Biden voting to let 4500 Americans, and 300,000 innocent civilians over seas die; while 20,000+ Americans were saddled with disabilities, and $Trillions of dollars of tax payer money was wasted on a War we were lied into starting.


It would be one thing if it was just incompetence on the part of Biden. It would be unacceptable for a Presidential Candidate but forgivable.

But NO - that’s not the case.

THE GUY IS GETTING PAID TO SELL YOU OUT.

And you are concerned about his feelings???

With all dude respect, you may have drunk too much of the Kool Aid to see reason.
 
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